May To Seek Coalition After Shock Hung Parliment Result

[StJames 376]

Just now, SEANGT said:

okay true. i guess even if you pay high/40% taxes already taking another 12% is a lot of money. if y'all have a high cost of living like we do idk how anyone survives tbh

The labour manifesto believes in taxing the wealthiest people heavily to fund the lives of low income homes and to make everything 'fair' and 'equal'. I personally take no issue in paying taxes at all and I believe there are people out there than truly need financial aid etc etc. It's part of life. But I don't believe in paying more simply to allow people to live off handouts just to make it fair. Sadly life is unfair and you get back why you put in.

[Morphine Prince 109,998]

The desperation. She should resign. 

[Petie Estie 5,741]

Just now, StJames said:

The labour manifesto believes in taxing the wealthiest people heavily to fund the lives of low income homes and to make everything 'fair' and 'equal'. I personally take no issue in paying taxes at all and I believe there are people out there than truly need financial aid etc etc. It's part of life. But I don't believe in paying more simply to allow people to live off handouts just to make it fair. Sadly life is unfair and you get back why you put in.

I see. Yeah, I mean same premise as the "far left" in America, but here, taxing the wealthiest means millionaires and the middle class is a much larger income bracket that theoretically have no tax increase or a modest increase. At least that's what Bernie Sanders wanted to do. Also when our conservative politicians talk about "handouts" they mean health care and food assistance. lol. So it's messed up. Hard to translate. 

Sorry to keep asking questions but I'm curious and googling this is hard because it's assumed knowledge in the UK lol. Since you guys already have health care, would the additional things you mean by "handouts" be more than just free college? Or I think I read that they want to put more into health care to cover more? Those seem legit. Is there anything really super liberal like a basic income given out to the very poor? 

[StJames 376]

11 minutes ago, SEANGT said:

I see. Yeah, I mean same premise as the "far left" in America, but here, taxing the wealthiest means millionaires and the middle class is a much larger income bracket that theoretically have no tax increase or a modest increase. At least that's what Bernie Sanders wanted to do. Also when our conservative politicians talk about "handouts" they mean health care and food assistance. lol. So it's messed up. Hard to translate. 

Sorry to keep asking questions but I'm curious and googling this is hard because it's assumed knowledge in the UK lol. Since you guys already have health care, would the additional things you mean by "handouts" be more than just free college? Or I think I read that they want to put more into health care to cover more? Those seem legit. Is there anything really super liberal like a basic income given out to the very poor? 

No questions are cool 😁 So in the Uk we have housing schemes which are government owned property called (council houses) and they are given to those in need for a greatly reduced rate. So if you rented one of these houses it could cost you as a private rented £400 a month. Now to someone of the council house schemes it would cost say £122. Now what can happen is people default on paying that £112 landing themselves in debt. That debt needs to be paid for, by the government (my taxes pay for that debt). There are many benefits you can have (for free) in this country based on your personal circumstanes (you get child allowance, tax credits, food credits, spousal income support, job seekers allowance) which is all freely given out. Not this isn't an issue because there are people that can't work for medical reasons or they care for a family member full time or have children etc. However there are thousands and thousands of lazy people that don't bother working because they get free handouts. The system doesn't always encourage people to get back into work. So my increase in tax would pay for those people as well as building 100,000s of new council homes to pay for people on low incomes to live. It's a take take take system 

 

so me working my arse off to earn good money is sent straight to people too lazy to work so they can live basically

 

thats just a small part of a much bigger picture 

[xoxo Craig 55,649]

10 minutes ago, StJames said:

The labour manifesto believes in taxing the wealthiest people heavily to fund the lives of low income homes and to make everything 'fair' and 'equal'. I personally take no issue in paying taxes at all and I believe there are people out there than truly need financial aid etc etc. It's part of life. But I don't believe in paying more simply to allow people to live off handouts just to make it fair. Sadly life is unfair and you get back why you put in.

But the Tories want to tax the poor and the disabled, cut taxes for the rich and reduce pensions. It should be that the rich pay more because that fair. The rich should be taxed the heaviest because the can afford to. Also they want to take away disability benifits, which is quite sick and horrible. They are evil with disgusting pollices, and asking the DUP for backing is the last straw. This country is a mess and its thanks to Theresa May and her party

[Petie Estie 5,741]

2 minutes ago, StJames said:

No questions are cool 😁 So in the Uk we have housing schemes which are government owned property called (council houses) and they are given to those in need for a greatly reduced rate. So if you rented one of these houses it could cost you as a private rented £400 a month. Now to someone of the council house schemes it would cost say £122. Now what can happen is people default on paying that £112 landing themselves in debt. That debt needs to be paid for, by the government (my taxes pay for that debt). There are many benefits you can have (for free) in this country based on your personal circumstanes (you get child allowance, tax credits, food credits, spousal income support, job seekers allowance) which is all freely given out. Not this isn't an issue because there are people that can't work for medical reasons or they care for a family member full time or have children etc. However there are thousands and thousands of lazy people that don't bother working because they get free handouts. The system doesn't always encourage people to get back into work. So my increase in tax would pay for those people as well as building 100,000s of new council homes to pay for people on low incomes to live. It's a take take take system 

hm. okay cool, thank you! There are studies/small examples that show a universal basic income and by extension I'd assume other wellfare programs that are very generous don't really make people not want to work. Although when I last looked into it there was nothing super conclusive and it didn't delve into nuances like people not going for a raise or not working *as hard*.

ANYWAY for now I'mma say I'd still support labour under corbyn if I lived there, which doesn't matter, but I like politics like other people like sports. I wanna know who to root for. lol. 

[StJames 376]

1 minute ago, Craig Barnes said:

But the Tories want to tax the poor and the disabled, cut taxes for the rich and reduce pensions. It should be that the rich pay more because that fair. The rich should be taxed the heaviest because the can afford to. Also they want to take away disability benifits, which is quite sick and horrible. They are evil with disgusting pollices, and asking the DUP for backing is the last straw. This country is a mess and its thanks to Theresa May and her party

I get what your saying but also for economic growth the conservatives have always out performed labour. Economic growth equated to more jobs, more jobs equates to more money and more money to change inequalities in our system. It's too sides of the coin, your saying I should pay more tax because I can afford to, I'm saying why should I pay you (not literally you) to live on handouts and support that only drives the government into debt. Corbyn (for what was costed) would have to borrow £250 billion to cover his manifesto (only 49 billion comes from taxing the top 5% which doesn't cover anything he proposed)

[xoxo Craig 55,649]

6 minutes ago, StJames said:

No questions are cool 😁 So in the Uk we have housing schemes which are government owned property called (council houses) and they are given to those in need for a greatly reduced rate. So if you rented one of these houses it could cost you as a private rented £400 a month. Now to someone of the council house schemes it would cost say £122. Now what can happen is people default on paying that £112 landing themselves in debt. That debt needs to be paid for, by the government (my taxes pay for that debt). There are many benefits you can have (for free) in this country based on your personal circumstanes (you get child allowance, tax credits, food credits, spousal income support, job seekers allowance) which is all freely given out. Not this isn't an issue because there are people that can't work for medical reasons or they care for a family member full time or have children etc. However there are thousands and thousands of lazy people that don't bother working because they get free handouts. The system doesn't always encourage people to get back into work. So my increase in tax would pay for those people as well as building 100,000s of new council homes to pay for people on low incomes to live. It's a take take take system 

 

so me working my arse off to earn good money is sent straight to people too lazy to work so they can live basically

 

thats just a small part of a much bigger picture 

People who live off benifts are not always too lazy. Most people have medical conditions or disablities which prevent them from working.

And we need more housing because thousands of people are too poor to even rent a small flat. Thats why benifits are good. All the Tories want to do is take that away from people making them more poor. She is keeping the rich rich and making poor people pay the heaviest price. Its not fair.

Oh, and have you heard of the Rape Clause?? Shameful and disgusting

[StJames 376]

1 minute ago, SEANGT said:

hm. okay cool, thank you! There are studies/small examples that show a universal basic income and by extension I'd assume other wellfare programs that are very generous don't really make people not want to work. Although when I last looked into it there was nothing super conclusive and it didn't delve into nuances like people not going for a raise or not working *as hard*.

ANYWAY for now I'mma say I'd still support labour under corbyn if I lived there, which doesn't matter, but I like politics like other people like sports. I wanna know who to root for. lol. 

That's the beauty of a democracy and it's amazing how many young people have voted this time round as well! 

[StJames 376]

1 minute ago, Craig Barnes said:

People who live off benifts are not always too lazy. Most people have medical conditions or disablities which prevent them from working.

And we need more housing because thousands of people are too poor to even rent a small flat. Thats why benifits are good. All the Tories want to do is take that away from people making them more poor. She is keeping the rich rich and making poor people pay the heaviest price. Its not fair.

Oh, and have you heard of the Rape Clause?? Shameful and disgusting

I agreee please don't take my opinions as I'm painting everyone on low incomes with the same brush. That would be foolish and short sighted of me. What I'm saying is that those benefits are NOT a RIGHT! They are a privelidge. There are many countries that don't offer anything and their people's are left to rot. In thinking these things are a right low income homes continues to expect handouts. I'm not saying that people don't need help I have friends who use the benefit system in some way or another. But it's not exhaustive. There isn't an infinite amount of spending power just for the social sector. Each time (check the figures) labour are in power this country is driven into debt! Tony Blair managed £500 billion in his term as PM

[Petie Estie 5,741]

4 minutes ago, Craig Barnes said:

People who live off benifts are not always too lazy. Most people have medical conditions or disablities which prevent them from working.

And we need more housing because thousands of people are too poor to even rent a small flat. Thats why benifits are good. All the Tories want to do is take that away from people making them more poor. She is keeping the rich rich and making poor people pay the heaviest price. Its not fair.

Oh, and have you heard of the Rape Clause?? Shameful and disgusting

i believe @StJames isn't defending the tories. But saying they didn't vote labour because it's just a little too far. They even mentioned that the programs are good, just if they were expanded they think it might go too far. Which to me isn't crazy because y'all already have way more welfare programs than we do in America, your conservative party is basically bernie sanders economically lmao. 

[StJames 376]

2 minutes ago, SEANGT said:

i believe @StJames isn't defending the tories. But saying they didn't vote labour because it's just a little too far. They even mentioned that the programs are good, just if they were expanded they think it might go too far. Which to me isn't crazy because y'all already have way more welfare programs than we do in America, your conservative party is basically bernie sanders economically lmao. 

You get it! I'd imagine america would be bankrupt if they gave out the type of benefits we give. It's simply not sustainable for this country give the increasing population and up until now the free roam immigration. That's another thing immegrants into the Uk get the same benefits with no previous investment from taxes. Everyone gets the same. I think immegration is fantastic it makes the population a melting pot of cultures etc but I don't agree with a family leaving their country for a better life in the Uk to live off benefits and a free house (there are a million documentries on this topic in particular worth watching)  

[Dominic 11,922]

1 hour ago, SEANGT said:

I'm American and reading a ton on this tonight because before this I didn't even understand how parliaments work lol. But it looks like the DUP is just going to keep the tories in power but not necessarily vote for their legislation. Which seems fine to me. It's not like the DUP has any power. They are just preventing the labour party from forming a majority coalition. 

 

1 hour ago, StJames said:

This! While they've have boosted torie seats they don't have the power to implement their disgusting anti-LGBt agenda etc etc. They are of benefit in that they too were pro Brexit and therefore this aligns with the results of the referendum 

It will be a confidence/supply deal. So they will support the Tories legislation and the Tories will rely on the DUP to pass legislation. Unless they opt for a vote-by-vote arrangement which would cause a lot of problems in the conservative party.

The DUP will also expect something in return for their support. Probably a number of their policies being included in the Queens Speech. 

The DUP themselves are pro-Brexit but they did not call for a hard-brexit so that will be a big clash with Conservatives as well as their desire to keep the Triple Lock. 

Either way it's not good having 10 MPs in parliament who are outwardly anti-gay and anti-abortion. In no way is that good. It won't last though, expect a vote of no confidence within the year. 

[xoxo Craig 55,649]

3 minutes ago, Dominic Marc said:

 

It will be a confidence/supply deal. So they will support the Tories legislation and the Tories will rely on the DUP to pass legislation. Unless they opt for a vote-by-vote arrangement which would cause a lot of problems in the conservative party.

The DUP will also expect something in return for their support. Probably a number of their policies being included in the Queens Speech. 

The DUP themselves are pro-Brexit but they did not call for a hard-brexit so that will be a big clash with Conservatives as well as their desire to keep the Triple Lock. 

Either way it's not good having 10 MPs in parliament who are outwardly anti-gay and anti-abortion. In no way is that good. It won't last though, expect a vote of no confidence within the year. 

My friend thinks we'll have another election later this year or early next year

[Dominic 11,922]

26 minutes ago, StJames said:

That's another thing immegrants into the Uk get the same benefits with no previous investment from taxes. Everyone gets the same. I think immegration is fantastic it makes the population a melting pot of cultures etc but I don't agree with a family leaving their country for a better life in the Uk to live off benefits and a free house (there are a million documentries on this topic in particular worth watching)  

I dont really think this is entirely accurate

Non-EU folk are not eligible for benefits (Jobseekers etc) and EU citizens typically have to jump through several hoops and the 'myth' that immigrants are 'taking our benefits' has been studied and results show it's just not that true.