"She created the world we live in," Diplo says about Madonna

[Echo 326]

It's so true, I don't get the hate. Like, Ghosttown is amazing.

[Kayla 7,595]

I respect Madonna's legacy. I acknowledge she sometimes copied others, paid homage to others, and contributed her own unique visions to Pop Culture. I was actually a fan of hers years ago. 

Her music was wonderful, performances iconic, and albums had huge impact. She pushed the boundaries and stood up for what she believed in. She's done things that people wouldn't dare replicate even nowadays, and things people pay homage to or replicate frequently.

My problem with Madonna now is she seems like she's jumping on the success of recent artists and constantly trying to get "In" with the youth of today. Like she tried to make a "comeback" (despite her legacy never going anywhere) by keeping up with the kids. There's nothing wrong with her doing what she wants, but sadly what she's doing doesn't seem genuine. 

It's not about her age- I don't think there's a problem there. It's about how desperate it looks. I have a problem with how she doesn't seem to be offering anything unique to her, but rather doing the things that have been working for others. 

And it seems tacky. She mooned people at the Grammy's, then claimed the reason people didn't like it was because she's in her 50s. No, people didn't like it because it's a try-hard thing to do. 

[Kayla 7,595]

Don't you think its a bit unfair to accuse Madonna & Miley of being attention *****s when Gaga literally wore a dress made out of meat & had a girl puke on her on stage? They're all attention *****s, period. 

 

Good point. No one says "I want to be a superstar because I really don't like attention," or "I put this album out and I hope people ignore it," that would be silly!

Being an "attention *****" isn't a bad thing if done genuinely, if that makes sense.

[ShockPop 7,747]

She has a bad attitude, no talent and the music is garbage. Earn success.

[Dunk96 2,526]

No, stop. Music consumers don't owe Madonna anything and we like what we like. 

Albums flop and albums succeed depending on multiple factors. Warriors, Britney Jeans, and ARTPOPs happen because they just don't  bring what the pop audience wants at the moment. It's a fact of pop life. 

Get over it. Stop complaining and produce/write music for Madonna that isn't cheesy. 

This!

[Jase 12,196]

Yeah, Ghosttown is a great record. If Katy sang it, she'd have a huge hit on her hands. That's sad.

[DrewStevens 5,249]

Her Blond Ambition Tour literally made Gaga's career and it was unprecedented by any pop artist back then, mixing dancing with fashion, theatre and dramatic costume changes. She was the first pop artist using fashion as an object of deliberate s-xual provocation. She also influenced the world of fashion by promoting the idea of underwear as outerwear. Ray of Light is universally seen as the first pop attempt to bring underground electronic dance music to the masses. She's also credited for being the first artist to transcend her "pop" category and establish herself as a global icon that single-handedly completely redefined what people could expect a female pop artist to do or say. The elements of s-xuality and religion in her work started a revolution for women in music. She's also credited as the first female pop star that sought financial control in the industry, got it and maintained it by continuously reinventing her image (again something entirely new in the industry), visually and musically (ring a bell?) and creating fashion and music trends all around her at least until 2000. She was also the first American pop icon to intentionally break taboos related to s-x, including support for the gay community and spreading awareness about HIV. She also launched the popularity of celebrity adoption, created a market for Voguing and burlesque dancing, defined MTV and the music video and pushed global attention towards other cultures and their visual/fashionable motifs when she referenced them, for example South Asia and Spain. She popularized Jewish mysticism and yoga, was the first woman in the mainstream eye who merged the s-xual with the sacred, earning her more controversy than any artist ever has up to this point.

So yeah, she was more original in her time than probably any pop artist after her. It's just hard to see it because we're all so used to seeing what Madonna worked her ass off to make happen.

I agree and I acknowledge her legacy and that she reinvented pop culture but she DID NOT created the world as we see it. She wasn't not the first one to do most things that are attributed to her. If Madonna was starting her career right now she would have been accused of stealing ideas from underground artists and appropriating cultures.

Most things you listed have been attributed to her by the media. She was not the first one to do most of those things. She was just the first mainstream artist to do it and some of those things were already done by Cher and other female artists.

[Riot Poof 2,236]

If we're talking about music ONLY, then I'm a bigger fan of Madonna than Gaga. I've been a stan since 2003, and her music was the soundtrack to my childhood. With that said, Madonna and her fans have this... smugness about them that just makes me want people to criticize her so she'll humble herself a little. I have a problem with Madonna stans acting like she was the only pop star to be innovative and that Gaga (and only Gaga) is a total carbon copy of her. This bothers me more than Gaga stans trying to deny Madonna's legacy because pop culture already immortalized her. Whatever people think about Madonna NOW, they'll think even less of Gaga's ENTIRE career (sans Gaga stans and some other young people). Gaga's even struggling when you compare her with her contemporaries, since people are starting to forget her peaks in light of the current successes of Katy, Bey, and Taylor. A great example of Madonna bias in the media was the "Born This Way" controversy. EVERYONE (who wasn't a Little Monster) took Madonna's side. This shows that the media is still biased towards Madonna.

Of course, the initial article had NOTHING to do with Gaga. But Diplo needs to accept that this is another flop era for Madonna, and that she deserves criticism because of it. I don't even think people are going in on Madonna that much. Madonna reached that stage in her career where she can release an album of her farting and it wouldn't ruin her career. She has tenure. Most critics will always have her back. Diplo should just get over it and produce something better for his girlfriend.

[Riot Poof 2,236]

If Madonna was starting her career right now she would have been accused of stealing ideas from underground artists and appropriating cultures.

Absolutely. SJWs would be out here writing thinkpieces on Madonna appropriating poor gay men ("Vogue"), not too far from how some people felt about Gaga's LGBT activism. Madonna's... fascination with Latinx, black, and Asian cultures would also be more heavily criticized. Some of y'all are saying that young people aren't giving Madonna enough credit, but they're also not criticizing her a lot on things she's done in the past, at least not on the level they criticize other (white) artists like Gaga, Katy, and Iggy.

[Riot Poof 2,236]

ONE FINAL THING: Some of y'all are messy to try to compare Gaga's music to Madonna's music. Cheek to Cheek is better than I'm Breathless?  The Fame is better than Madonna's entire discography? 

[PEDRO98 1,003]

where is your source diplo?? 

[Bear 7,515]

I think the problem Madonna is having is she is trying to tap into a market group that just isn't interested in her.

The music she is making isn't by any means bad, but it isn't Madonna. Most of it is very bland + could be sung by any pop artist and the harsh reality is that the target audience she is trying to appeal to would much rather see young and fresh pop girls singing it than Madonna trying to imitate it. It seems inauthentic when she does it, almost awkward even. 

She's a brilliant artist and innovator, she should stick to what she does best and set trends rather than trying to follow them. 

 

[Rae 86]

I think Glen Beck hit it on the nail about Madonna https://soundcloud.com/glennbeck/beck-blitz-lady-gaga-proves#t=0:00

You can listen to it all or

 Start at 3:10 , Madonna at 3:50  

"Times have changed."

[Psychedelic 1,098]

I agree and I acknowledge her legacy and that she reinvented pop culture but she DID NOT created the world as we see it. She wasn't not the first one to do most things that are attributed to her. If Madonna was starting her career right now she would have been accused of stealing ideas from underground artists and appropriating cultures.

Most things you listed have been attributed to her by the media. She was not the first one to do most of those things. She was just the first mainstream artist to do it and some of those things were already done by Cher and other female artists.

The tea right there *sips.gif*

She has a bad attitude, no talent and the music is garbage. Earn success.

Reaching much? Singing isn't the only talent a popstar can stick to... Other than having limited vocal ability, Madonna can dance, song-write, produce, play drums, guitar (very well), she is in control of her everything she does, albums, performances, tours and supervises of every detail, lighting, costumes, videos, etc. Not to mention she's always had message, she isn't manufactured star or a puppet. And she's admitted this herself "I dind't go into the music bussiness because I thought I had a beautiful voice, but because I've always had something to say"

As for the bad attitude, yes, she can be a b---h, but she can also be a loving and caring human being, people just like to focus on the negative side.

Her music now might not be as good, but it isn't garbage, there tons of songs out there by young people that are in deed garbage, yet they are given a chance and achive some success. 

So earn succes? Tell that to the 80's, 90's, 00's when the woman did wonderful things. At this point I don't think she has anything to prove!

[Didymus 32,909]

I agree and I acknowledge her legacy and that she reinvented pop culture but she DID NOT created the world as we see it. She wasn't not the first one to do most things that are attributed to her. If Madonna was starting her career right now she would have been accused of stealing ideas from underground artists and appropriating cultures.

Most things you listed have been attributed to her by the media. She was not the first one to do most of those things. She was just the first mainstream artist to do it and some of those things were already done by Cher and other female artists.

But she was (and still is, even about her old days) already accused of stealing ideas from underground artists and appropriating cultures back in her day However, she is seen as one of the first artists who set that trend, which isn't exactly a very glamorous credential but it still is one.

I don't agree about the "just the first mainstream artist" putdown though. It takes guts to do something that's not mainstream as a mainstream artist. In her own environment, she was the most original out there. If that's not enough for the people who just care too much about criticizing her, then they should put the same shoe on someone like Gaga. If Madonna isn't original, Gaga can't be at all

I'm definitely not saying that Madonna is an original artist but she did singlehandedly change what pop stars (and women) could do and eventually did. Without Madonna, things would've looked very differently on a lot of fields. Whether that's because of her originality or her balls to push new things in mainstream culture is quite irrelevant in that context.

And the media reference is a bit misleading too, since most of my claims actually come from historians, sociologists and other social scientists. I don't really get what you mean with "Cher and other female artists" about my specific post. I personally don't know that any other female artist did anything what I said Madonna did first. But if I can be corrected with proof, of course I stand corrected.