Raven-Symoné: "I'm not African-American, I am American"

[Gov Hooka 8,008]

Colour blindness is nothing to do with erasing your history and culture. It's just about not putting race on such a high pedestal. It's about not having race be the first thing you notice about a person, not defining people by their race (which can lead to stereotypes and assumptions) and promoting the right to live in a unified society where the colour of one's skin doesn't matter. You can be proud of your heritage and indulge in it and inform others about it, but not to the point where you refuse to integrate or identify with other races. What's on the outside doesn't define you, it's what's on the inside. Your outer appearance has no bearing on who you are on the inside. I understand that having a name for a disadvantaged group had its benefits in the past. It raised the status of a group who had been forced to be invisible and ignored under the control of rich white people. Having a name to refer this group said: "We exist, we are strong and we deserve to be here." But there's no need to worry about that element anymore because the black community is huge in America, with lots of very successful blacks in the media and in everyday life. In the early-late 00's, black people ruled the music scene too and now they're making a comeback. Basketball and football teams are really dominated by blacks. I think this proves that labels like African American are not needed anymore. Blacks are such a solid fixture in America (13.2% of the country is black) that they are completely American. If they were born in America and lived their whole life in America, why should it matter what their race is, or anyone else's, for that matter? It's weird that it's just America that has this fascination with racial identity whereas the rest of the world tries its best to integrate in the country that they're not originally from without bringing their race into their identity.

 

And by the way, seeing as some people have brought up Hispanics, this is another thing that's an American-only thing: viewing Hispanic/Latino as a race. Its technical definition is an ethnicity. The entire American continent seems to be the only countries that view Hispanic/Latino as a race and don't consider themselves white. Hispanics are any natives of Central America, South America, Cuba, Puerto Rico, Spain and Portugal. But the Spanish and Portugese don't consider themselves a different race, it's purely a continental American idea. Yes, Hispanics have certain visual differences between them and whites, but not to the extent where they're a separate race. There are many different facial features among whites too - particularly among Scandanavian whites and Mediterranean whites. But that doesn't make them not white. Just because someone's skin is a little bit darker than pure white or there is a slight exotic look to them doesn't make them not white. The perception of white people is that we're all blue-eyed, blonde haired with nothing exotic about us when in fact, there's diversity among all races. Hispanics are just a variation of whites. Don't get me wrong: if you are Hispanic/Latino, be proud, speak Spanish/Portugese, bask in your culture. But be mindful of what being Hispanic actually means. Look up the definition on dictionaries, Wikipedia, the US Census Bureau's definition and so on. It's an ethnicity, not a race.

once again

[uo111 5,246]

African-American and Black are not interchangeable words. I think some people are confused by this.

Yes but that's the way people in the US use them.

 

Raven did a poor job of clarifying what she meant, and many people are going to read it as, "I am not black, I am American."

 

Which is obviously wrong and it's doubtful that's what she was trying to say, but when you are using language in a way that isn't mainstream, you have to be clear.

 

 

 

 

 

Also, the America hate is getting so ridiculous in this thread. As though no European countries have racism. Europe hardly has any blacks, so you literally don't see it.

 

http://atlantablackstar.com/2014/01/08/8-worst-countries-black-people-travel/

http://imdiversity.com/villages/global/racism-against-blacks-is-a-growing-trend-in-europe/

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Black_British

 

And the idea that Americans don't consider themselves Americans is ludicrous. Whoever thinks that anyone could ignore race, or that they themselves ignore race, is disconnected from reality.

[JazzGa 14,413]

I guess I agree,  but gawd what an inflammatory thing to say on tv

[Morphine Prince 101,455]

Also, the America hate is getting so ridiculous in this thread. As though no European countries have racism. Europe hardly has any blacks, so you literally don't see it.

I usually denounce the America hate and I don't see any in this thread  

[uo111 5,246]

I usually denounce the America hate and I don't see any in this thread

The hate is the suggestion that the US places extreme emphasis on race when every other country has moved on. Which is simply not true. The US doesn't place more emphasis on race, it just seems that way because the US actually has racial diversity. And other countries have lackluster race relations with the very small proportion of colored people living in those countries.

 

It's unfounded. Based solely on media portrayal and an idealistic image of ones own country.

[StrawberryBlond 13,932]

Yeah, but Hispanics don't consider ourselves white. We're half breeds White/Indiginous. Although technically Hispanic/Latino is an ethnicity. In forms it usually asks "Are you Hispanic/Latino?" and then "Race" which we are forced to fill in "White" although we are not really white.

But really Hispanics can be any race and combination. White/Native = Mestizo, White/Black = Mulatto, etc.

 

Really? You're happy to refer to yourself as a half breed? I don't understand where the "indiginous" part comes in. This is the problem with people who aren't black or Asian referring to themselves as non white. What word can they use then? I've seen some whites who are darker than some Hispanics, so the concept that Hispanics are not white is really weird to me. I have heard about how Hispanics struggle with what option to pick in certain forms when the race question comes up. I saw an episode dedicated to mixed race girls on the Tyra Banks show and it annoyed me that there were Hispanics there treating Hispanic as a race. One even said she was "half black, half Puerto Rican." As if Puerto Rican is a race now. It's that weird race + nationality thing again. But anyway, about the form thing, the half white/half Hispanic girl once said that when filling in a form, she once tried to select white but was told: "You will not mark "white," you will mark "other." Which I guess could by a byword for "mixed race" but the girl did look completely Hispanic so I doubt she was percieved as mixed. But certainly in my country she would be called white without hesitation.

 

In Canada, we don't consider Hispanics a race either - any more than Italians or Greeks are a race.

I wonder if the US decision to define them as racially other makes white American more hostile to Hispanic immigration than they might otherwise be.

 

Indeed - where there's less Hispanics, there's less demand for them to be seen as their own unique group. And I agree that yes, marking Hispanics, who look basically white as non white creates tension where there doesn't need to be. It makes people stereotype how a Hispanic looks so that they'll know one just from looking at them. And that is no way to promote racial harmony. There are plenty of Hispanics who could pass for full on white. I once met a woman born and lived in Barcelona to Spanish parents who had blue eyes and blonde hair. When I went to Marbella and went into the supermarket, I saw people in the checkout who I thought looked like fellow white holidaymakers until they started speaking fluent Spanish with thick accents. Not every race can be presumed just by looking at a person. Putting pale whites (white European decendants) and slightly darker whites (Hispanics) into subdivisions is needlessly complicated.

[Morphine Prince 101,455]

Really? You're happy to refer to yourself as a half breed? I don't understand where the "indiginous" part comes in. This is the problem with people who aren't black or Asian referring to themselves as non white. What word can they use then? I've seen some whites who are darker than some Hispanics, so the concept that Hispanics are not white is really weird to me. I have heard about how Hispanics struggle with what option to pick in certain forms when the race question comes up. I saw an episode dedicated to mixed race girls on the Tyra Banks show and it annoyed me that there were Hispanics there treating Hispanic as a race. One even said she was "half black, half Puerto Rican." As if Puerto Rican is a race now. It's that weird race + nationality thing again. But anyway, about the form thing, the half white/half Hispanic girl once said that when filling in a form, she once tried to select white but was told: "You will not mark "white," you will mark "other." Which I guess could by a byword for "mixed race" but the girl did look completely Hispanic so I doubt she was percieved as mixed. But certainly in my country she would be called white without hesitation.

That was a joke lol. 

 

But Hispanics can be any race. There are white Hispanics, black, or any of the other mixes I mentioned. Hispanics treat it like it's a race although it isn't. The problem in the US is that for example, Hispanics that are black won't identify as being black. I have a Colombian friend who is black. She never refers to herself as black though. She just says she is Hispanic (again, many Hispanics treat it as a race), and she says black people are those we call "African-Americans." It's this huge misinformation on race and ethnicity that makes it confusing. I also know white Colombians who don't refer to themselves as white. To them white people are something else.  

[Morphine Prince 101,455]

The hate is the suggestion that the US places extreme emphasis on race when every other country has moved on. Which is simply not true. The US doesn't place more emphasis on race, it just seems that way because the US actually has racial diversity. And other countries have lackluster race relations with the very small proportion of colored people living in those countries.

 

It's unfounded. Based solely on media portrayal and an idealistic image of ones own country.

And we have a fairly recent racist past. 

[StrawberryBlond 13,932]

The hate is the suggestion that the US places extreme emphasis on race when every other country has moved on. Which is simply not true. The US doesn't place more emphasis on race, it just seems that way because the US actually has racial diversity. And other countries have lackluster race relations with the very small proportion of colored people living in those countries.

 

It's unfounded. Based solely on media portrayal and an idealistic image of ones own country.

 

Are you saying the US is the only country with racial diversity? You do know that African countries are some of the most racially diverse countries in the world? And even countries that are known for their racial diversity like the UK, France and Germany, are actually very low on the diversity-ometer. Here is a handy map made by experts:

http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/worldviews/wp/2013/05/16/a-revealing-map-of-the-worlds-most-and-least-ethnically-diverse-countries/

As you can see, the US isn't even coded pale green and surprisingly, Canada is more racially diverse. The US may be one of the most diverse but it's not the only one. And while there's friction between races in every country, we're not hostile towards each other and are trying our best to straighten things out. Handling race relations differently is not the same to handling them badly.

 

That was a joke lol. 

 

But Hispanics can be any race. There are white Hispanics, black, or any of the other mixes I mentioned. Hispanics treat it like it's a race although it isn't. The problem in the US is that for example, Hispanics that are black won't identify as being black. I have a Colombian friend who is black. She never refers to herself as black though. She just says she is Hispanic (again, many Hispanics treat it as a race), and she says black people are those we call "African-Americans." It's this huge misinformation on race and ethnicity that makes it confusing. I also know white Colombians who don't refer to themselves as white. To them white people are something else.  

 

Oh, ok. It's just hard to judge that online.

 

Indeed, Hispanics can be any race. And yes, black Hispanics can really struggle with calling themselves. Though the half black/half Hispanic girl on Tyra Banks said she identified herself as black (the audience thought she looked more Hispanic, though, which I disagreed with). Being a darker shade of white and growing up with a very different culture makes you more inclined to think you're not white, I guess. It's not surprising how confused so many people are about race vs. nationality vs. ethnicity when things like racism and xenophobia are treated as the same thing - it's all called racism now. And because we don't like to talk about a sensitive subject like race, this confusion just keeps going.

[Morphine Prince 101,455]

Oh, ok. It's just hard to judge that online.

 

Indeed, Hispanics can be any race. And yes, black Hispanics can really struggle with calling themselves. Though the half black/half Hispanic girl on Tyra Banks said she identified herself as black (the audience thought she looked more Hispanic, though, which I disagreed with). Being a darker shade of white and growing up with a very different culture makes you more inclined to think you're not white, I guess. It's not surprising how confused so many people are about race vs. nationality vs. ethnicity when things like racism and xenophobia are treated as the same thing - it's all called racism now. And because we don't like to talk about a sensitive subject like race, this confusion just keeps going.

Yeah, I mean most people (at least in the US) would not consider this family "White": 

 

 

Although on government forms they would most likely check "White" under the "Race" category. 

[uo111 5,246]

And we have a fairly recent racist past. 

I don't really understand what that has to do with the race relations in other countries, and while it is a large cause of the race relation issues in the United States today, that doesn't automatically make our American identities less meaningful or our racial issues more divisional.

 

Also, most European countries also have recent racist paths as well. Eugenics was practiced only until distaste for Nazi Germany caused people to think twice about what they were doing.

 

 

Are you saying the US is the only country with racial diversity? You do know that African countries are some of the most racially diverse countries in the world? And even countries that are known for their racial diversity like the UK, France and Germany, are actually very low on the diversity-ometer. Here is a handy map made by experts:

http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/worldviews/wp/2013/05/16/a-revealing-map-of-the-worlds-most-and-least-ethnically-diverse-countries/

As you can see, the US isn't even coded pale green and surprisingly, Canada is more racially diverse. The US may be one of the most diverse but it's not the only one. And while there's friction between races in every country, we're not hostile towards each other and are trying our best to straighten things out. Handling race relations differently is not the same to handling them badly.

I was talking mostly about European countries when I said those countries don't have racial diversity.

 

That map is about ethnic diversity. Uganda is the most ethnically diverse, but according to wikipedia "Europeans, Asians, and Arabs make up about 1% of the population with other groups accounting for the remainder." So, a little less than 99% of the population is black, or African, whichever you prefer.

 

I agree with that.

 

This is from that same website http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/worldviews/wp/2013/05/15/a-fascinating-map-of-the-worlds-most-and-least-racially-tolerant-countries/

 

I almost find that hard to believe

[Tropico 4,145]

Oh, how I love Raven.

[comrade 33]

my favorite african-american is charlize theron anyway

[Jesse Pinkman 4,660]

I agree with her. At the end of the day, despite our origins we are all American. This is why I've been a fan of hers for 10+ years.

my favorite african-american is charlize theron anyway

:deadbanana:

[Azor Ahai 18,861]

I don't like labels-Labels her self "American"

 

Gurl u flopped hard.