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Ukraine-Russia Crisis Discussion (Post all related news here)


Melech

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Melech

Then there should be a split, however splits are always messy :noparty:

Not necessary. Slovakia and Czech Republic splitted peacfully :yes:

War feels closer than ever.

ikr,i thought we would never expierence something like this. It's so scary for us,Europeans, because it is so close to us

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Sam Winchester

Not necessary. Slovakia and Czech Republic splitted peacfully :yes:

ikr,i thought we would never expierence something like this. It's so scary for us,Europeans, because it is so close to us

I don't think that would happen in this case though from the way it's looking. I mean just look at the situation: deaths during the protests and now Russia sending in troops?

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Melech

I don't think that would happen in this case though from the way it's looking. I mean just look at the situation: deaths during the protests and now Russia sending in troops?

Yes,I just wanted to say that it is possible.

I don't know how it will end in Ukraine. It could end in every possible way we can think of. I just hope it will end soon without a lot death

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Chill out, there's nobody Russia can fight in Ukraine. They are sending troops in order to:

- to give the new government a clear sign that they don't respect it all, deny it's legitimate and still believe Yanukovich is the president

- to protect the pro-western regions from possible conflicts and clashed with pro-western ones.

The war needs an enemy, while they don't have one.

One European country entering another country with military troops, causing other countries to raise a finger while most people say it's nothing. Doesn't this scenario remind you of another? 1938.

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Melech

Lemme remind u gurl that Ukrainian president was elected at elections, and this new proEU government is radical and took power by coup and not democratic elections. They fright people and threat. You want Ukrainian president to be USA/EU puppet. Putin and Ukrainians say no. Now Ukraine will split, just like Yugoslavia did. Bye

Yugoslavia splited because they wanted. There were referndums in Bosnia-Herzegowina,Croatia,Slovenia,Mazedonia and Montenegro and they all wanted independence. 

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bumblebee

There always these small steps which cause a war.

It feels rather like a Cold War 2.0.  EU vs. Russia

 

To be honest, on the political level the Cold War has never stopped. The tensions and disagreements between the USA and Russia have been going on and on ever since Putin came back to power. 

 

Trust me on this: I am politically a very liberal person, but I never understand why the USA is always portrayed as a saint state which is the guard of world peace. The political system within USA is close to very good, but the foreign affairs of the US have been very strange.

 

 What was the Iraq war for? How much of the nuclear weapon did they find there? 

What are the results of the Afghanistan war? 

What was the Libyan war for? 

Yugoslavia? 

 

The list can be fulfilled with many other places, but the idea is simple. The US military presence overseas is also controversial, but they nevertheless took those military actions. For them it's like OK. 

 

Once Russia starts military operations, everybody starts screaming it's the comeback of The Evil Empire without getting all the facts right.

 

Is it logical?  

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sovereign

Yugoslavia splited because they wanted. There were referndums in Bosnia-Herzegowina,Croatia,Slovenia,Mazedonia and Montenegro and they all wanted independence. 

Nope. Im Yugoslavian and i know. All seccessions were unconstitutional (read: illegal).

 

Maybe Crimea (or more parts of Ukraine) now want independence! ? ;)

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ikr,i thought we would never expierence something like this. It's so scary for us,Europeans, because it is so close to us

The foreign minister of UK just announced they will defend Ukraine from Russia if military actions would happen, Jesus

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Melech

To be honest, on the political level the Cold War has never stopped. The tensions and disagreements between the USA and Russia have been going on and on ever since Putin came back to power. 

 

Trust me on this: I am politically a very liberal person, but I never understand why the USA is always portrayed as a saint state which is the guard of world peace. The political system within USA is close to very good, but the foreign affairs of the US have been very strange.

 

 What was the Iraq war for? How much of the nuclear weapon did they find there? 

What are the results of the Afghanistan war? 

What was the Libyan war for? 

Yugoslavia? 

 

The list can be fulfilled with many other places, but the idea is simple. The US military presence overseas is also controversial, but they nevertheless took those military actions. For them it's like OK. 

 

Once Russia starts military operations, everybody starts screaming it's the comeback of The Evil Empire without getting all the facts right.

 

Is it logical?  

I totally agree with you. I'm not a fan of America policies and I'm also not a fan of Russian policies.

The thing with Ukraine is that both EU and Russia are interested in that. Ukraine has a lot natural resources. EU wants to get more influence in the East. And it already worked. Moldova and Georgia already signed treaties with EU and may become possible member states of EU as well. 

 

And instead Russia lets Ukraine decide they feel the need to intervene and it's just a matter of time when EU will intervene as well. 

Nope. Im Yugoslavian and i know. All seccessions were unconstitutional (read: illegal).

 

Maybe Crimea (or more parts of Ukraine) now want independence! ? ;)

When I was in Croatia ,the Croatians told me that they were glad that it doesn't exits anymore. 

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bumblebee

One European country entering another country with military troops, causing other countries to raise a finger while most people say it's nothing. Doesn't this scenario remind you of another? 1938.

 

I don't think there are any comparisons possible to make together with the 1938, as neither Russian political leaders nor Russian people carry the ideas in their hands that any nation or race can be supreme compared to another one.

 

It's also unlikely Russian troops will send anybody out of Ukraine into concentration camps.

 

Finally, the military conflict is very unlikely. The troops are controlling roads and airports, in order to prevent tensions between pro-western and pro-Russian representatives. In Kiev alone almost 100 people were killed because of the protests. It would be stupid to let more victims appear in this conflict. I don't support any military actions at the moment, but I just beg people to realize the troops are not entering the villages and killing civilians, they're basically only being present there, and doing nothing. 

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Melech

The foreign minister of UK just announced they will defend Ukraine from Russia if military actions would happen, Jesus

Yep. Angela Merkel just said that she is worried as well. And let me tell you,when Angie is worried things getting very serious. 

On Monday the foreign ministers of all EU states will meet. 

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bumblebee

I totally agree with you. I'm not a fan of America policies and I'm also not a fan of Russian policies.

The thing with Ukraine is that both EU and Russia are interested in that. Ukraine has a lot natural resources. EU wants to get more influence in the East. And it already worked. Moldova and Georgia already signed treaties with EU and may become possible member states of EU as well. 

 

And instead Russia lets Ukraine decide they feel the need to intervene and it's just a matter of time when EU will intervene as well. 

 

 

 

Honestly, I can't understand what prevents them from establishing two mega-regions (Eastern and Western) under a single state, and initiating a kind of free trading zone in the Western mega-region. This seems like the only reasonable compromise 

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Melech

Honestly, I can't understand what prevents them from establishing two mega-regions (Eastern and Western) under a single state, and initiating a kind of free trading zone in the Western mega-region. This seems like the only reasonable compromise 

I'm not quite sure if I understand. So you mean the only solution would be a free trading zone and splitting the Ukraine?

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I don't think there are any comparisons possible to make together with the 1938, as neither Russian political leaders nor Russian people carry the ideas in their hands that any nation or race can be supreme compared to another one.

It's also unlikely Russian troops will send anybody out of Ukraine into concentration camps.

Finally, the military conflict is very unlikely. The troops are controlling roads and airports, in order to prevent tensions between pro-western and pro-Russian representatives. In Kiev alone almost 100 people were killed because of the protests. It would be stupid to let more victims appear in this conflict. I don't support any military actions at the moment, but I just beg people to realize the troops are not entering the villages and killing civilians, they're basically only being present there, and doing nothing.

I was not comparing to say this is anything like the nationalism and nazism that happened in 38 I just meant that the whole scenario is shaky. It's not up to Russia to just casually occupy another country with troops. This is illegal by international law and Putin is well aware of it. I don't know it's just all so shady. It's obviously not good to just stand by while Ukraine is imploding from within but this is definitely not the desired situation either.

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