The most SICKENING MV this year, VOTY imo

[Lukas96 800]

9 minutes ago, moonsago said:

But what I love about kpop is this insane glamorization of everything, the discipline, the attention to detail, the hard work, the talent backed up by skill, something a lot of western acts miss nowadays, the overall investment into creating a product that can leave you in awe. Maybe it’s the perfectionist in me that is always attracted to what looks perfectly glazed like a donut. That’s an art-form too. 

It's completely subjective. I personally prefer to see "flaws" and more of the artists' personanility shine through and mix with the genre than seeing the genre above the artist and that's something I don't get from K-pop, I can enjoy it, I can listen to it, I don't hate it but I don't gravitate towards it.

Also, I know that "perfection" in K-pop comes at the expense of the artists' mental health, so it makes me feel extremely uneasy.

[moonsago 5,373]

3 minutes ago, Lukas96 said:

It's completely subjective. I personally prefer to see "flaws" and more of the artists' personanility shine through and mix with the genre than seeing the genre above the artist and that's something I don't get from K-pop, I can enjoy it, I can listen to it, I don't hate it but I don't gravitate towards it.

Also, I know that "perfection" in K-pop comes at the expense of the artists' mental health, so it makes me feel extremely uneasy.

May I go back to your previous comment for a second because I have another point to make. You said something along the lines that the audience needs to grasp who you are instantly and know your identity as an artist. Now let me ask you... how many identities can there REALLY be? Because that’s a very broad and dangerous statement you made. The reality is that there’s only so much an artist can do to stand out and be ‘unique’ as you claim. And what’s so original and unique about Rosalia’s video? Have music videos on the beach with friends never been done before to say that people will recognize it’s her material when they see it? And what’s so original about using puppets in your music video? Have I seen it with the sound of I could of guessed it was a tv show or something, and music videos using the same ‘essence’ as you say have been filmed before. Two of the artists you claim to be unique and have a particular identity, don’t. There’s nothing so out of the ordinary original about either of them. As for the queen Bjork, indeed, she is the first to do a lot and you could argue that she will be recognized. And it’s true, she will. But she also borrows from new artists to create her universe. Imagery like that exists elsewhere too. You talk about some form of fictional originality really, because the reality is that we are limited. There’s only so many ways to get dressed to not look like somebody else, so many sets you can build to not look like others... things reference themselves, there isn’t a lot one can do. So really, while the artists you chose don’t have much in common ( again, you chose them from different genres too, I did not, that was the point ), they aren’t unique and original either in the grand scheme of things. If I look at them as superficially as you looked at my 3 recommended videos, I can also claim lack of substance and individuality. But again, you mixed the format of kpop with the artistry in it. And that’s the problem. Kpop involves dancing, singing, rapping, etc, you get the idea as I am repeating myself lmao. That’s the foundation of it. 
As for the mental health comment. It is very true, it can come at the expense of some of their mental health, but let’s not act like the western industry is much better, we know very well how many pop stars are mentally ill here as well because of the industry and what it does to them. So it’s really just a different situation, same form of evil. Also, I get what you are saying about the ‘flaws’, I enjoy that too with my western artists, but just because of that, the genre doesn’t shine more than the art in kpop, it’s again just your personal perception of it. A lot of idols produce and write their music as well and are what we like to call ‘authentic’ ( a word I hate because it’s used to stupidly when describing western music ) in the west and talk about their personal thoughts, ideas, struggles, it’s not always a team of writers ( which happens in the west too ). 

[dzox 552]

7 hours ago, pachinko said:

What is black pink doing? Releasing? 

Yes, they're releasing their 2nd album and a music video for their new single

[NATAH 31,384]

this is just a lot of special effects and set pieces... nothing that artistic or special about it

also those lyrics are... certainly lyrics

[moonsago 5,373]

2 minutes ago, NATAH said:

this is just a lot of special effects and set pieces... nothing that artistic or special about it

also those lyrics are... certainly lyrics

And what exactly is a music video if not also about special effects and set pieces...? Like... that’s what a music video entails you know? Also, if you wanna talk about storylines, please. Not every music video needs to have a storyline, and not all the music videos we all love and praise do. Expose your bias, you hated it before you saw it. 

and what is artistic and who are you to judge it ultimately? 

[NATAH 31,384]

Just now, moonsago said:

And what exactly is a music video if not also about special effects and set pieces...? Like... that’s what a music video entails you know? Also, if you wanna talk about storylines, please. Not every music video needs to have a storyline, and not all the music videos we all love and praise do. Expose your bias, you hated it before you saw it. 

i've just seen people do a lot better with a lot less  

it's all style with no substance which is fine but not enough to hail it as video of the year. bjork's recent video for her lead single has no storyline but it has a lot to depict from the set pieces, her outfits and actions and relation to the lyrics

[Rj Barker 3,317]

Pleasing to the eye but nothing special feel like I've seen the same video 20 times before. The song itself is also awful so that probably doesn't help. The second video you posted was better and the somg was a marginal improvement on the first. 4 out of 10 for me.

[NichuuB 43,421]

7 hours ago, moonsago said:

It’s a gorgeous music video, I saw it yesterday and was gagged, however I stand by my statement. 

Queen

[Lukas96 800]

28 minutes ago, moonsago said:

May I go back to your previous comment for a second because I have another point to make. You said something along the lines that the audience needs to grasp who you are instantly and know your identity as an artist. Now let me ask you... how many identities can there REALLY be? Because that’s a very broad and dangerous statement you made. The reality is that there’s only so much an artist can do to stand out and be ‘unique’ as you claim. And what’s so original and unique about Rosalia’s video? Have music videos on the beach with friends never been done before to say that people will recognize it’s her material when they see it? And what’s so original about using puppets in your music video? Have I seen it with the sound of I could of guessed it was a tv show or something, and music videos using the same ‘essence’ as you say have been filmed before.  There’s nothing so out of the ordinary original about either of them. As for the queen Bjork, indeed, she is the first to do a lot and you could argue that she will be recognized. And it’s true, she will. But she also borrows from new artists to create her universe. Imagery like that exists elsewhere too. You talk about some form of fictional originality really, because the reality is that we are limited. There’s only so many ways to get dressed to not look like somebody else, so many sets you can build to not look like others... things reference themselves, there isn’t a lot one can do. So really, while the artists you chose don’t have much in common ( again, you chose them from different genres too, I did not, that was the point ), they aren’t unique and original either in the grand scheme of things. If I look at them as superficially as you looked at my 3 recommended videos, I can also claim lack of substance and individuality. But again, you mixed the format of kpop with the artistry in it. And that’s the problem. Kpop involves dancing, singing, rapping, etc, you get the idea as I am repeating myself lmao. That’s the foundation of it. 
 

I never used the word unique, that's your interpretation of what I wrote. Nor did I claim the artist I used as examples were unique (although it's a given with Björk, and I'd dare you to find someone who has Rosalia's sound),  I said there were substantial differences between those three videos.

I also NEVER used the word originality, originality in art doesn't exist, it's all been done before. You completeley missed my point there.

"you chose them from different genres too"... no, they're all pop artists. "I can also claim lack of substance" not what I claimed about k-pop though.

28 minutes ago, moonsago said:

 
As for the mental health comment. It is very true, it can come at the expense of some of their mental health, but let’s not act like the western industry is much better, we know very well how many pop stars are mentally ill here as well because of the industry and what it does to them. So it’s really just a different situation, same form of evil. 

 

You would have to agree that suicide is worringly prevalent in idols though, and yes it does stem in part from the stigma on mental health, but also from the extremely hard working conditions.

28 minutes ago, moonsago said:

A lot of idols produce and write their music as well and are what we like to call ‘authentic’ ( a word I hate because it’s used to stupidly when describing western music ) in the west and talk about their personal thoughts, ideas, struggles, it’s not always a team of writers ( which happens in the west too ). 

I never said they didn't. In fact I don't particularly think not writing your music makes you less authentic of an artist, what would that make anyone doing theater or opera then ? 

My criticism was aimed more towards the visuals and overall repetitiveness in the genre than anything else.

[moonsago 5,373]

1 minute ago, NATAH said:

i've just seen people do a lot better with a lot less  

it's all style with no substance which is fine but not enough to hail it as video of the year. bjork's recent video for her lead single has no storyline but it has a lot to depict from the set pieces, her outfits and actions and relation to the lyrics

And again, that is your opinion. Lmao this was mine, do you really think anybody can REALLY choose the video of the year or the song of the year and so on objectively? No, because art is subjective in it’s nature. I was being sarcastic claiming so in a general manner, didn’t think so many people would have such a problem with it. It’s just my personal pick. Also, Don’t forget you are reading translations, korean is very complex, some words mean entire expressions, translations never do kpop songs justice. Not saying this song is most likely poetry, I am sure it isn’t but still. Lol No offense, I really don’t mean to come across as mean or like I have a personal problem with you but, it’s comments like yours that said nothing really valid, but so many leave to try and discredit something that they either have a bias against or dislike. Sets and special effects? Well duh, it’s a music video. Just say you like something else and keep it moving, you don’t have to try to bring down something that obviously looks amazing weather you like it or not. Quality can’t be disputed, taste and art yes, again, it’s subjective.  

[NATAH 31,384]

Just now, moonsago said:

And again, that is your opinion. Lmao this was mine, do you really think anybody can REALLY choose the video of the year or the song of the year and so on objectively? No, because art is subjective in it’s nature. I was being sarcastic claiming so in a general manner, didn’t think so many people would have such a problem with it. It’s just my personal pick. Also, Don’t forget you are reading translations, korean is very complex, some words mean entire expressions, translations never do kpop songs justice. Not saying this song is most likely poetry, I am sure it isn’t but still. Lol No offense, I really don’t mean to come across as mean or like I have a personal problem with you but, it’s comments like yours that said nothing really valid, but so many leave to try and discredit something that they either have a bias against or dislike. Sets and special effects? Well duh, it’s a music video. Just say you like something else and keep it moving, you don’t have to try to bring down something that obviously looks amazing weather you like it or not. Quality can’t be disputed, taste and art yes, again, it’s subjective.  

girl if you're just gunna get defensive over opinions, why make the thread anyway?

my comment is just as valid as calling it "video of the year", sorry

[NichuuB 43,421]

6 hours ago, tmo13 said:

nah sorry, this is the best music video of the year.

the storytelling. the aesthetic. the cinematography. the bridge.

it's perfect. you can't tell me otherwise!

oh wow, this mv is produced by Alaska. I love their videos and theyve been slaying with their work

[Irrelevant 20,272]

sm almost never flops visually but nct continues to set the bar lower sonically

[moonsago 5,373]

2 minutes ago, Lukas96 said:

I never used the word unique, that's your interpretation of what I wrote. Nor did I claim the artist I used as examples were unique (although it's a given with Björk, and I'd dare you to find someone who has Rosalia's sound),  I said there were substantial differences between those three videos.

I also NEVER used the word originality, originality in art doesn't exist, it's all been done before. You completeley missed my point there.

"you chose them from different genres too"... no, they're all pop artists. "I can also claim lack of substance" not what I claimed about k-pop though.

You would have to agree that suicide is worringly prevalent in idols though, and yes it does stem in part from the stigma on mental health, but also from the extremely hard workin conditions.

I never said they didn't. In fact I don't particularly think not writing your music makes you less authentic. 

My criticism was aimed more towards the visuals than anything else.

See, I have to disagree, they are not all pop stars doing the same kind of genre to put them together the same way you would with kpop artist to indeed belong to a genre, however, you talked about identity in regards to music videos, in the grand scheme of things, they don’t have a particular identity that sets them apart completely without reference to anybody else. That’s the breakdown I did, in regards to their visuals. I don’t understand what does Rosalia’s sound have to do with this? Maybe the confusion is being created because of the way kpop is seen as more than just music and when we talk about western artists and their genres we only talk about music. If that makes sense to you. But I still stand by the idea that you can’t get passed the format of kpop, something you do with western artists. 

Suicide is worryingly prevalent in Korea in general, it is not an isolated issue within kpop. It’s relevant to their entire culture, from school to work to home life and the still set back mentalities in regards to many social issues. It’s a more complex issue than to just pin it down on kpop idol training. The idols that have commited suicide in the past few years for example have done it because of bullying ( a huge issues in korea ) and other problems. But I am not discrediting the idea, as said perviously, that the training system can cause mental health problems to some. 

I know you didn’t say they were inauthentic, it’s just something I wanted to add because that’s another miss-conception about kpop. 

[moonsago 5,373]

17 minutes ago, NATAH said:

girl if you're just gunna get defensive over opinions, why make the thread anyway?

my comment is just as valid as calling it "video of the year", sorry

Literally where did I get defensive? Did you read the comment? Somebody offering you an explanation to something isn’t getting defensive. I was even making it clear to you that I don’t mean to make it seem like I have something with you. Your comment is not the same as my comment. I made an obviously subjective statement while you just pointed out sets and special effects like... anyways, all love to you.