Official Israel/Palestine Conflict Discussion Thread

[Pennywise 30,149]

1 minute ago, LittleMonster20 said:

But don’t you see how that’s unfair to the people in the country itself, who have no influence on what’s happening? Again, the fans of that country can’t help the fact that they live there, does that really mean they don’t deserve to see their favorite artists because of what their country is doing?

Also I don’t see simply giving a performance in a country as supporting a country, it’s not like the artists that come there go to political gatherings and actually engage with the situation.

Of course it is unfair to the people. War always hurts the people in the end while governments make profit. But at this moment, you can't expect others to care as much about Israeli people's concerts as much as Palestinian people's lives. If there wasn't an active war- no, genocide actually - going on at the moment, I'd say that you could be right. But in the face of such violence, I do think that even a simple tweet in support of the... genocidal, side, would be bad, let alone a performance. 

[LittleMonster20 9,317]

Just now, Bambino said:

What it's a competition now? Them having different backgrounds adds nothing to the fact that it's an apartheid system. If you're on Twitter, just check the current worldwide trends and see for yourself what's happening right now in Palestine. Some people are live from the events.

Nowhere did I state that one has it worse than the other and I’m aware of what’s happening. ALL I’m saying is how the people in a country with a problematic reputation shouldn’t be affected by it themselves and should be able to attend a concert if they want to.

[LittleMonster20 9,317]

Just now, Pennywise said:

Of course it is unfair to the people. War always hurts the people in the end while governments make profit. But at this moment, you can't expect others to care as much about Israeli people's concerts as much as Palestinian people's lives. If there wasn't an active war- no, genocide actually - going on at the moment, I'd say that you could be right. But in the face of such violence, I do think that even a simple tweet in support of the... genocidal, side, would be bad, let alone a performance. 

I get that and if there was a concert happening at this very moment then I get why it could be considered bad. But we’re basically talking about shows from a few years ago when the situation in Israel at least was still somewhat peaceful, and these shows got cancelled simply due to a political disagreement, which was truly unfair in my opinion at least because the people in the country had no effect on that.

[Magic Mike 1,972]

I have friends that represented my country in Eurovision in Tel Aviv. During the tours around the city, they told them to never buy a certain kind of bottled water... And so they experimented: they were insulted and looked away as disgusting beings. It turns out that brand of water is directed to Arabs only! My friends felt then what was like to feel so much prejudice in ....Israel... where a new Holocaust is happening 

[lego 44,165]

1 hour ago, LittleMonster20 said:

I get that and if there was a concert happening at this very moment then I get why it could be considered bad. But we’re basically talking about shows from a few years ago when the situation in Israel at least was still somewhat peaceful, and these shows got cancelled simply due to a political disagreement, which was truly unfair in my opinion at least because the people in the country had no effect on that.

 

No, actually Gaga performed in 2014, after Israel’s heavy bombardment of Gaza when over 500 children were killed. The situation was far from peaceful. Maybe it looked peaceful in Tel Aviv, where the concert was held, but did she care to look a bit further in the neighborhood, how Palestinians feel? How their homes look like? Activists were calling her to cancel, she ignored and said “she knows people in the White House, she will be safe”. Palestinian fans and activists were not asking her to refuse because of her safety, but because Israel would use her for their propaganda, to improve their image. Even today they’re using what she said, as if it’s paradise to live there and everyone who thinks otherwise is wrong. I remember all this, like it was yesterday. I really hope she got more educated on the subject, since then. 

Edited May 13, 2021 by lego

[alsemanche 68,950]

4 hours ago, AndiGaga said:

I know this will be controversial

But how can LGBTQ+-People be against Israel? Its the only place in this region where we are worth SOMETHING. If Palestine would become a state or Israel would be destroyed, million of people (women included) would loose their human rights

Google pink washing and purple washing and you'll get your answer

"I'm queer so I should support a settler colonial state that's committing genocide" is such a weird take that I will absolutely never understand 

 

[alsemanche 68,950]

Also an update on the Palestinian situation right now: Palestinian houses are being bombed over the heads of their owners and there are bodies and injuries under the rubble. Also, civilian Israeli mobs who are armed are lynching people in the streets and in their homes in many areas of Palestine. According to the last numbers I've seen, over a 100 Palestinian martyr has fallen so far (27 of them being children) and there are over 600 injuries. This is all in 4 days. People are leaving their houses with nowhere to go once again. 

Edited May 13, 2021 by alsemanche

[PartySick 119,032]

3 minutes ago, lego said:

 

No, actually Gaga performed in 2014, after Israel’s heavy bombardment of Gaza when over 500 children were killed. The situation was far from peaceful. Maybe it looked peaceful in Tel Aviv, where the concert was held, but did she care to look a bit further in the neighborhood, how Palestinians feel? How their homes look like? Activists were calling her to cancel, she ignored and said “she knows people in the White House, she will be safe”. Palestinian fans and activists were not asking her to refuse because of her safety, but because Israel would used her for propaganda, to improve their image. Even today they’re using what she said, as if it’s paradise to live there and everyone who thinks otherwise is wrong. I remember all this, like it was yesterday. I really hope she got more educated on the subject, since then. 

If Gaga never performed anywhere an atrocity or injustice was taking place then she'd never perform anywhere  I mean, unless we want to watch a livestream of the Chromatica Ball from Antarctica where only penguins are attending.

Don't get me wrong, I get what y'all are saying, Israel is on another level than a lot of global/internal conflicts, I'm just throwing my (honestly worthless) two cents in

[alsemanche 68,950]

3 minutes ago, PartySick said:

If Gaga never performed anywhere an atrocity or injustice was taking place then she'd never perform anywhere  I mean, unless we want to watch a livestream of the Chromatica Ball from Antarctica where only penguins are attending.

Don't get me wrong, I get what y'all are saying, Israel is on another level than a lot of global/internal conflicts, I'm just throwing my (honestly worthless) two cents in

But that's the thing: there is an active organized movement that stands against cultural and economic normalization with Israel. BDS (Boycott, Divest, Sanction) is very much alive and it's very much effective. It worked in apartheid South Africa and, if actually followed widely, will work in colonial Israel. Gaga was called to respect that but instead she went ahead, performed there, AND (whether consciously or not) contributed to Zionist propaganda that paints Israel as a heaven. And this is the reason I would never ever buy anything Gaga sells, be it music or merch or concert tickets. I realize that even being here is technically supporting her, but I do what I can at the end of the day. And proof that BDS works: Zionists are terrified of it. Whenever an artist cancels their concert there, they lose it and start trashing them left and right. It happened with Lorde, it happened with Lana, and with endless others who answered the call to BDS. Another proof is that BDS is banned in many Western countries (Canada being one of them, France too I think?). 

[Bambino 22,596]

14 minutes ago, PartySick said:

If Gaga never performed anywhere an atrocity or injustice was taking place then she'd never perform anywhere

It's not injustice or atrocity, it's basically ethnic cleansing against Palestinians, along with numerous war crimes, crimes against humanity and many other stuff confirmed illegal by international law.

Edited May 13, 2021 by Bambino

[lego 44,165]

2 minutes ago, PartySick said:

If Gaga never performed anywhere an atrocity or injustice was taking place then she'd never perform anywhere  I mean, unless we want to watch a livestream of the Chromatica Ball from Antarctica where only penguins are attending.

Don't get me wrong, I get what y'all are saying, Israel is on another level than a lot of global/internal conflicts, I'm just throwing my (honestly worthless) two cents in

 

This was literally right after the massacre, she knew about it, it was all over the news. But back then, most Westerners seemed  to believe that was just “Israeli right to defend itself”. The excuses were too many.. 

[Bambino 22,596]

Just now, lego said:

 

This was literally right after the massacre, she knew about it, it was all over the news.

Of course she did. It was reported back then that the White House provided her with assurances that she'd be safe playing in there. She knew.

[lego 44,165]

1 minute ago, Bambino said:

Of course she did. It was reported back then that the White House provided her with assurances that she'd be safe playing in there. She knew.

 

it’s sad that she probably thought she’s being brave, performing in a country “after war, lifting spirits of young fans, many of whom were idf soldiers”. Who are Palestinians anyway?  

[Bambino 22,596]

So far, 109 Palestinians were killed, including 28 children and 15 women, while 621 were injured in the ongoing Israeli aggression on Gaza.

[lego 44,165]

 

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