ARTPOP, bad or misunderstood?

[BleepBloop 10,191]

50/50 I think.

There are some great tracks and ideas on here, and others some are really just overproduced and messy

[gagaxsebert 5,804]

I’ll start by saying that I love ARTPOP as an album. I wasn’t a “stan” back then (rly young and only listened to Rihanna religiously) but looking back on what I “missed out on” is the most interesting of any era. I think ARTPOP is too much to understand, musically, visually & the era as a whole.

You can head in the record something wasn’t right with Gaga. Reflecting, this record is a last goodbye & and a f*ck you to the music industry. Gaga wasn’t ok but she was very aware people were awaiting her downfall. I feel like ARTPOP as an era (musically etc.) is Gaga’s most “unique” era, great for fans, but it was too different for people to understand or be comfortable with, for Gaga also.

[intotherosegarden 57]

1 hour ago, Benji said:

It’s a bad album.  Fans go to extraordinary lengths to defend how bad it is but it’s just simply bad.

It was scraped together from uninspired sessions because Gaga was in no place to make an album.  With no realised concept and a jumble of songs that were just reused instrumentals sang over, they tried getting away with giving it a massive concept that ultimately means nothing.

It’s about time fans accept it’s a bad album and move on like Gaga has.

THIS. Gaga was so far from a place to have a comeback album from injury. But she didnt really have a choice. I think this is in part why Chromatica took as long. She was depressed for this era as well but in different ways. And the end product has similar messages to ARTPOP but are way better phrased and articulated, even if her lyricism isnt as sky high or pumped with metaphor as her earlier stuff.

[AJRocketMan 2,684]

Neither, to be honest. I think it was too ambitious. I believe she should have made an album with a simpler theme (or no theme at all) and scaled back the costume-y outfits. Cultural exhaustion with Gaga had settled in around 2011 because people thought she was taking herself too seriously and her novelty had worn off. And it was true. With ARTPOP, she should’ve made a carefree dance album with simpler marketing tactics and a more casual, cool-girl image. Instead, she just went even weirder, and people weren’t here for it. She gave them the exact opposite of what people wanted (and what her career needed atm). I enjoy ARTPOP but it was too ambitious for a 27 year old. That’s something I can see her doing in middle age.

[ARTGOD 3,266]

1 hour ago, Candy Gaga said:

What I meant about the lyrics of these songs is that they seem shallow. They're not fun or ambitious like The Fame or dark and bold like TFM or unique and inspiring like Born This Way. Even the lyrics of Joanne followed the theme of depression and pain much better through most of the songs. When it comes to ARTPOP a lot of people dismiss it cause the lyrics were clueless and non inspired and you can have the best production ever but if lyrics are unrelatble the album won't connect to people. ARTPOP main focus lyrics wise was a collection of songs about catwalks , fashion , strange expressions about sex like someone here said earlier felt like a try hard.

Production problem is it's majorly a DJWS style of production which is a loud noisy rave sound that doesn't fit mainstream music. It's like even the songs that have something to offer were ruined by a sudden out of place beat drop or heavy out of place production element.

Also you can't tell me songs like MANiCURE or Jewels and Drugs haven't aged . Those aged 2 months after release.

Also I don't agree with that Chromatica lacks flavor that ARTPOP had. In fact it added much flavour and substance that ARTPOP needed to smash and connect to people. On  Chromatica there's something for everybody. Like the EuroDance (Eurovision sound) that appeals to millions of people ( on Sine From Above , 1000 Doves or Enigma ) Pop sound that appeals to old school fans and General Puplic ( Replay , 911 and Plastic Doll ) she even attracted new fans and demographics with songs like ( Rain On Me and Sour Candy )

I hope you just don't get upset by this debate. You know at the end of the day my opinion is just an opinion that changes nothing. If you love ARTPOP then keep listening to it and consider it the best in her discography just like everyone do with their favourite album 

I just wanna start by saying that I didn’t get upset, I just like debating with people and I always try to understand where they’re coming from. I think deep, thoughtful conversations are something that’s kinda lacking in this forum. I actually chose your comment because I think you’re a fun person to debate with .

I think ARTPOP’s lyrics are really good tbh, they tend to be a little obtuse and kinda irreverent, and definitely not as direct as Chromatica’s, but I think there’s a lot of depth to be found once you dig a little deeper. I deeply disagree with your assessment that ARTPOP is only about sex and fashion. There are lyrics about female empowerment, her relationship with the media, her trauma and sexual abuse, feeling misunderstood, her addiction to weed and alcohol, her loneliness due to being a famous person, and songs about being an artist and making art.

Even the songs that are about sex tackle the topic in ways that I find to be really unique and fun. There aren’t many songs about having a secret relationship with someone in your dreams. I think there’s as much lyrical depth in ARTPOP as in most of her albums, and I think you should give the lyrics another chance.

I do agree that DJWS’ sound is not mainstream and is very loud, but for people that like ARTPOP that’s kinda the appeal of it. It’s the abrasiveness and the constant dynamics what makes it so interesting and fun to relisten.

I think MANiCURE and Jewels N Drugs do sound like they belong in a particular era in music, and so does the whole album tbh. The thing is, not sounding timeless or fresh is not necessarily a negative to me, and the album is original enough that even for someone who is familiar with electronic music, or listened to the radio around that time, it still has so many original and unique ideas to offer. That’s what makes the album a worthwhile listen to this day.

MANiCURE is a mix of pop, rock and trap, a mix that you don’t really find that often, especially not in the mainstream. Jewels N Drugs may be trap, but it’s so instrumentally interesting and structurally weird, that when you listen to it you don’t think “ugh, I’ve heard this a million times on the radio”.

I actually think Chromatica did the exact opposite of what you said tbh. Doesn’t an album that’s less abrasive, less loud, that has something for every demographic and tries harder to connect with people sound like something less flavorful?.

Chromatica to me sounds exactly like what you get when you make an album with a less strong and uncompromising artistic vision, less weirdness, less experimentation and less loudness than ARTPOP. That to me is removing flavor, though I guess there’s a high level of subjectivity.

[Candy Gaga 5,374]

55 minutes ago, ARTGOD said:

I just wanna start by saying that I didn’t get upset, I just like debating with people and I always try to understand where they’re coming from. I think deep, thoughtful conversations are something that’s kinda lacking in this forum. I actually chose your comment because I think you’re a fun person to debate with .

I think ARTPOP’s lyrics are really good tbh, they tend to be a little obtuse and kinda irreverent, and definitely not as direct as Chromatica’s, but I think there’s a lot of depth to be found once you dig a little deeper. I deeply disagree with your assessment that ARTPOP is only about sex and fashion. There are lyrics about female empowerment, her relationship with the media, her trauma and sexual abuse, feeling misunderstood, her addiction to weed and alcohol, her loneliness due to being a famous person, and songs about being an artist and making art.

Even the songs that are about sex tackle the topic in ways that I find to be really unique and fun. There aren’t many songs about having a secret relationship with someone in your dreams. I think there’s as much lyrical depth in ARTPOP as in most of her albums, and I think you should give the lyrics another chance.

I do agree that DJWS’ sound is not mainstream and is very loud, but for people that like ARTPOP that’s kinda the appeal of it. It’s the abrasiveness and the constant dynamics what makes it so interesting and fun to relisten.

I think MANiCURE and Jewels N Drugs do sound like they belong in a particular era in music, and so does the whole album tbh. The thing is, not sounding timeless or fresh is not necessarily a negative to me, and the album is original enough that even for someone who is familiar with electronic music, or listened to the radio around that time, it still has so many original and unique ideas to offer. That’s what makes the album a worthwhile listen to this day.

MANiCURE is a mix of pop, rock and trap, a mix that you don’t really find that often, especially not in the mainstream. Jewels N Drugs may be trap, but it’s so instrumentally interesting and structurally weird, that when you listen to it you don’t think “ugh, I’ve heard this a million times on the radio”.

I actually think Chromatica did the exact opposite of what you said tbh. Doesn’t an album that’s less abrasive, less loud, that has something for every demographic and tries harder to connect with people sound like something less flavorful?.

Chromatica to me sounds exactly like what you get when you make an album with a less strong and uncompromising artistic vision, less weirdness, less experimentation and less loudness than ARTPOP. That to me is removing flavor, though I guess there’s a high level of subjectivity.

Thank you so much I actually enjoy chatting with you cause you're always fun and doesn't get offended by nearly anything haha

Well yeah I agree that music is subjective. But let's look at it from another direction what are the songs on ARTPOP that represent the stronger side of that album. I'd say Applause , Dope , Venus , Aura and Swine for example they represent different themes on the album like freedom , power , depression , her love for art and sex. When I got to Chromatica I found songs that represent those themes and even more with a much stronger and deeper approach. It's like she dug deeper in the themes , with songs like Replay about PTSD that to me is better than anything on ARTPOP , songs about hope and letting go like Sine From Above etc. And what helped Chromatica for me is that the production doesn't give me a headache and not too loud and messy sometimes. Also I'm a bit biased cause my favourite 4 genres are all subgenres of EDM-Pop ( Euro-Dance / Electro-Pop / Synth-Pop / Dance-Pop ) and that's basically what Chromatica is maybe you enjoy a more unique louder production and more playful lyrics that's why you prefer ARTPOP if I'm correct.

[Lighter 15,376]

It is. She’s just trying to be respected as a fine as artist as much as she is as commercial artist. But y’all didn’t see that. She served jeff koons and the birth of venus in our face, she just wants the credit that she’s not just a factory pop star. 

[HermesGr 669]

I LOVE the album! It has some of her best songs ever n on my top 10 of all her songs! (Aura, Venus, ARTPOP) it was the circumstances I guess totally wrong and kinda her state of mind on that era who didn’t help the vision.. but the sound was very good.  

[VasilisVas 4,647]

I just thought the music was bad. I tried to get into it but I just couldn’t. The only songs on the album that are good (to me at least) are Venus, sex dreams, ARTPOP, and applause. ARTPOP is the only Gaga album I didn’t purchase upon release. I ended up purchasing it a few months (December 2019) ago because I was out shopping and happened to stumble on it and figured I might as well buy it just to add to my Gaga collection (yes 6 years after the release). Every other album Gaga has released is far superior. Yes, even Joanne, which lots of you love to bash even though it’s a beautiful album. Anyway, everyone has their own taste and everyone is entitled to their opinion.

[HermesGr 669]

Ok let’s do this: Chromatica  VS ARTPOP....

 

Alice vs Aura 

Stupid love vs Venus

Rain on me vs GUY

Free woman vs Sexxx dreams 

Fun tonight vs Jewels n drugs 

911 vs Manicure 

Plastic doll vs Do what u want

Sour Candy vs ARTPOP

Enigma vs Swine 

Replay vs Donatella

Sine from above vs Fashion! 

1000 Doves vs Mary Jane Holland 

Babylon vs Dope

Love me right vs Gypsy

1000 Doves piano 😁🤷‍♂️ Vs Applause 

 

4 Chromatica vs 11 ARTPOP

*(I m not ok with Alice vs Aura tho cause I want them both in)

 

 

[Nicoxxx 1,467]

Chromatica is everything ARTPOP wished to be 7 years ago.

[SpiritBunny 2,961]

ARTPOP was a curse that we deserved to suffer through and will continue to suffer through until we all pass away. 

[stevana229 1,780]

ARTPOP is a great pop album, but Gaga wasn't all there mentally... in some of her interviews she acts SO weird and doesn't make sense AT ALL and sometimes talked with an accent... I feel like all of that just made the GP confused. Not to mention Miley Cyrus and Katy Perry were dominating music in 2013

[LadyInsecto 366]

This is literally ARTPOP. The art (Monalisa) in pop (Gaga).

[waterlikemisery 1,008]

It's not her best, I won't argue about that, but it is my favorite album ever. It just is. It's deep and personal, and I just adore ARTPOP and I always get so excited when gaga talks about it, it's sooo special to me. I love every bit of it, unreleased songs to the songs that made the cut, from the outfits to the live performances. So good.