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Was Joanne a flop? (Be honest)


theahsfan

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YeehawKylie
4 minutes ago, Albertodift said:

This is an attempt to capture oldGa's essence but it fails. (especially the John Wayne MV..it was too chaotic and did not let you absorb the beautiful scenes and imagery that was there). There is no editing and no restraint..it's all over the place. 

The Coachella interludes or w/e are awesome! but they are not mvs...Gaga cannot properly execute an MV and that is that. 

Her music is still top notch, her live skills are amazing, her albums are great! Her more recent mvs? Just bad. plain and simple. 

I respect your opinion, but feel differently. While I do agree John Wayne is an attempt to capture the essence of her old videos, I don't think it is an attempt to recreate her older videos. I think the quick-paced editing suits the song, especially as it steadily builds as the video nears its end.

That being said, interludes count as visuals. Concert interludes are very important visuals to an album era, I think back to Kylie Minogue's epic Sleepwalker interludes which were high style, conceptual visuals. They very much count and are a testament to the musicians artistic vision and ability. 

In regard to her video quality, the only weak video I feel like she's released is Million Reasons (and even that, I only really object to the black and white sequences). Perfect Illusion perfectly fit the song and had incredible visual shots, editing, and color scheme. The only other video I can find fault with is G.U.Y. As that one I did find the editing entirely jarring. :sweat:

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SpookyKid
Just now, Albertodift said:

I actually feel like PI is her best MV in a while tbh. I know it is disliked by most but in my opinion it is her best Joanne MV. It is well shot, the sequences are really good, even the seizure inducing scenes are purposely made that way to fit the chaotic nature of the song. It is not meant to look beautiful it was meant to express the anger in the song so it really captured that properly. 

John Wayne was extremely underwhelming for me though and MR is just....BAD. I know the mv required simplicity but there is a way to properly execute simplicity and MR was not that (in my opinion of course!)

I love PI :D I agree that MR is badly done, but I still kinda like it, I don't know why

Life has a hopeful undertone |-/
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10 minutes ago, IndieKylie said:

I respect your opinion, but feel differently. While I do agree John Wayne is an attempt to capture the essence of her old videos, I don't think it is an attempt to recreate her older videos. I think the quick-paced editing suits the song, especially as it steadily builds as the video nears its end.

That being said, interludes count as visuals. Concert interludes are very important visuals to an album era, I think back to Kylie Minogue's epic Sleepwalker interludes which were high style, conceptual visuals. They very much count and are a testament to the musicians artistic vision and ability. 

In regard to her video quality, the only weak video I feel like she's released is Million Reasons (and even that, I only really object to the black and white sequences). Perfect Illusion perfectly fit the song and had incredible visual shots, editing, and color scheme. The only other video I can find fault with is G.U.Y. As that one I did find the editing entirely jarring. :sweat:

 

10 minutes ago, SpookyKid said:

I love PI :D I agree that MR is badly done, but I still kinda like it, I don't know why

omg guys can we take a second to appreciate how we just had a nice, friendly interaction/debate/convo without any one coming in and getting messy or mean lol We seem to all have differing opinions but I really love that yall posted interesting and respectful responses. Thanks!

and yes I do agree with you @IndieKylie that interludes are really important and do showcase if an artist still has artistic direction and visual aptitudes. I'd love to see that level of precision and work done with her actual music videos though. It's like they are still able to properly execute small short framed visuals but unable to properly execute a full 4 minute MV for some reason. G.U.Y had so much editing issues and also camera frame issues. I do not know how to translate certain filming terminology into english as I studied them in Spanish in film courses I took and literally even some "point of view shots" in the G.U.Y, MR and JW mvs are rookie level at best. Small details in those mvs that may be looked passed at really bothered me as they were mistakes that professionals should not make. Ruth has been doing this for ages and the MV director for JW is literally a legend...I do not understand how they let certain editing, camera framing and sequencing issues slide by like that...it's disheartening. When all those issues pile up they end up making un pleasant mv experiences for fans such as myself. 

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YeehawKylie
1 hour ago, Albertodift said:

omg guys can we take a second to appreciate how we just had a nice, friendly interaction/debate/convo without any one coming in and getting messy or mean lol We seem to all have differing opinions but I really love that yall posted interesting and respectful responses. Thanks!

I know, I really do respect and completely understand your point of view and where you're coming from!:hug:

I do think so much of her visuals come down to collaboration (and there's nothing wrong with that!). The G.U.Y. Video was great conceptually but really needed better editing. Gaga was in full creative control, so I think it really lacked restraint as even Gaga admits she has trouble editing down. 

John Wayne and Perfect Illusion are more successful due to the collaborations. There's a more watchful eye andfluid production throught both works, in my opinion. Some of the details in Perfect Illusions are so subtle, which I love. It's hard to upstage videos like Paparazzi and Bad Romance, but it's hard to do that with the songs on Joanne, they're just more understated or raw. So, it's tough to compare and, unfortunately, we got robbed of some videos during ARTPOP! :emma:

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4 minutes ago, IndieKylie said:

I know, I really do respect and completely understand your point of view and where you're coming from!:hug:

I do think so much of her visuals come down to collaboration (and there's nothing wrong with that!). The G.U.Y. Video was great conceptually but really needed better editing. Gaga was in full creative control, so I think it really lacked restraint as even Gaga admits she has trouble editing down. 

John Wayne and Perfect Illusion are more successful due to the collaborations. There's a more watchful eye andfluid production throught both works, in my opinion. Some of the details in Perfect Illusions are so subtle, which I love. It's hard to upstage videos like Paparazzi and Bad Romance, but it's hard to do that with the songs on Joanne, they're just more understated or raw. So, it's tough to compare and, unfortunately, we got robbed of some videos during ARTPOP! :emma:

I actually really agree with this and I guess I never thought of it that way tbh. I cannot really be too tough on the Joanne MVs because the music does not really lend itself to intricate mvs. Maybe I was too hard on it. I will wait for the next pop album to see what she delivers with visuals. I think it would only be fair to wait for more poppy type of songs to compare it to her past work I guess. 

Spoiler

though I will never get over how bad the MR video was in my heart :'( 

and yes omg plz do not remind me of the lack of mvs from the AP era :giveup:

at least she gave us 3 mvs for Joanne era. Even for a non single. I think it was her way of apologizing for the lack of MVs from both eras because both eras were cut short. (though she does not really need to apologize for the lack of AP videos because of the personal stresses she was going through.) but more so for the lack of Joanne singles and mvs I guess. 

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Not The Real Gaga
5 hours ago, Venusfly said:

Joanne actually did great in the US, its in the top rankings for sales in its year :) her international performance was subpar but Joanne had a heavy americana vibe that was never going to resonate well outside of the US. Europe & Oceania likes its dancepop. The Cure's international performance is great evidence she still has her international grip.

Plus the album wasn't available in many European countries due shipping problems during its release. We had to wait longer, don't think that had a positive effect on the international sales either.

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shoful
5 hours ago, Saint Hollywood said:

It spawned a platinum, top 5 single

The album itself is platinum

Wait what!????:duck:

In the US?????

"My name is Dita, I'll be your Mistress tonight..."
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Arturo
5 minutes ago, shoful said:

Wait what!????:duck:

In the US?????

It is not. I think he means it sold over 1M WW. Although that does not indicate Platinum since there is no such thing as a worldwide certification.
According to the way the RIAA counts YT streams into their certifications, Joanne isn't that far off from being Platinum in the U.S though. It's at ~800k+ RIAA units. 

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Arturo
37 minutes ago, ChrisC said:

It did okay in America I guess but everywhere else....

It did good in N. America/S. America and everywhere else that it lacked support The Cure is making up for it (Aus, U.K, etc)

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beboskoukla
6 hours ago, Supersonic said:

Best selling album of 2016: Beyoncé - Lemonade - 3M copies sold worldwide

Comparison: Lady Gaga - Joanne - 1,4M copies sold worldwide (so far)

Gaga sold half as last years MEGA blockbluster that kept everybody WW talking, if that's not good then I don't know what is.

i never listend to one song of lemonade xD and in switzerland it wasnt even promoted...

xoxo, Katarina
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TimisaMonster

Overall...yes it was :shrug:

I believe fans and GP a like were a bit..."confused" as to why Gaga went this weird country pop direction with her music when it was implied she'd be going back to her dark pop sound. 

Oh well... OG LG5 will remain locked in a vault along with all the other betrayals including ACT II

Stream my new single, 💜"Heartbeat"💜, on Spotify!
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The Z
12 hours ago, androiduser said:

but The Cure didn't crack Top 10 in the official charts, being successful on iTunes for a few days is not the same as having an official Top 10 hit :huh:

True, but Million Reasons is a true #1 hit and it's still considered as a #4 one:laughga:

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