Lady Gaga responds to Lena Dunham: You're special Lena

[OliverViennese 1,164]

6 minutes ago, StrawberryBlond said:

True, some women did say they liked the realistic interpretations. But a small group of women don't speak for every woman. I know that I'm in the minority here but when it comes to sex scenes (simulated, that is, I don't watch p*rn), I actually prefer to see attractive people doing it. I also want to see enjoyable sexual encounters without anything gross, cringey or depressing. That's not hot. And I know that the point of these scenes wasn't to be alluring but in that case, do we need to see it all, in all its depressing glory? Girls inspired a whole host of similar shows due to its success and after hearing about the ones inspired by it showing on British tv now, it just makes me go "ugh." Why do women not strive to be beautiful in these shows anymore? Why is there no urge for self-improvement? Just because you're "normal" doesn't mean you have to be ugly. Plenty of normal girls are prettier than most celebrities I've seen, even without make-up. Women like Lena Dunham make up shows involving unattractive people having sex to pacify their own insecurities about themselves, like "everyone else is hotter than me, so I'm going to make a show where I look plain and act disgusting in the hope this becomes the norm!" I really don't like being told over and over that normal women aren't pretty and don't have sex like in the movies. A lot of people do, actually and the sad part is, they can't be confident in their looks or sexual abilities because they'll get called out as being stuck-up, self-obsessed bitches. But isn't having confidence in yourself supposed to be empowering and feminist? As a feminist, I want to see my fellow women happy, not depressed. Showing women at their lowest as part of a feminist depiction because it's "realistic" (apparently) is not part of my thinking. I know my views differ from the average feminist but I want women to be complex, not to have hive minds and follow their own beliefs instead of ones that they think they're supposed to follow.

Here was the full article from the critic I referenced. This is back when the series just started out. It sums up my views exactly:

http://www.independent.co.uk/voices/comment/girls-is-not-diverse-not-feminist-and-not-empowering-8224704.html

And here was another one talking about the sexist, derogatory language aimed at women in the series:

https://www.theguardian.com/tv-and-radio/2016/mar/21/rabidly-sexist-lena-dunham-language-rules-feminists

I do get your point, but it's not like you don't have a big number of other shows to choose from, if you're not into this kind of representation - even if it inspired some same-fomular shows. At least to me it doesn't seem as if those would outnumber the other discussed depiction. And although I do get where you're coming from, I would say that not everybody can be happy with every kind of portrayal. Either you might have some people "called out as being stuck-up self-obsessed bitches" like you said, otherwise you have  people feeling completely left out or outlandish for having not-so-glamorous sex and flaws in their behaviour.

I actually found the women in Girls more complex than i find women in most tv shows I watch and it's not like they don't have happy phases. It's just that nothing's ever perfect and that's what is shown. The dating world can be tough, a romantic relationship can be very hard and staying friends for a long amount of time can be difficult and it doesn't always work out.

About those articles - I will not get into discussing it rn, because it's just a little much. There are some great arguments made there and some things I do not agree with. But I respect the opinion and it's fine. The series - to me - is not flawless by any means. But I myself enjoyed it alot better than most shows I watch.

It was interesting to discuss this with you! 

[VOLANTIS 16,006]

On 9/23/2017 at 9:22 PM, Tan Fei said:

who is she

A self admitted child molester. 

[NewYorkCity 10,462]

Omg I didn't know about the drama of this girl fingering her little sister but you guys are too much lmao 

like seriously? SHE WAS 7 YEARS OLD. OMG It is NORMAL. You seriously call a 7 YEARS OLD a sexual abuser and child molester? I think you are the ones with problems in your head if you see that in a 7 years old brain. I can't believe it  

 

[StrawberryBlond 13,240]

22 hours ago, OliverViennese said:

I do get your point, but it's not like you don't have a big number of other shows to choose from, if you're not into this kind of representation - even if it inspired some same-fomular shows. At least to me it doesn't seem as if those would outnumber the other discussed depiction. And although I do get where you're coming from, I would say that not everybody can be happy with every kind of portrayal. Either you might have some people "called out as being stuck-up self-obsessed bitches" like you said, otherwise you have  people feeling completely left out or outlandish for having not-so-glamorous sex and flaws in their behaviour.

I actually found the women in Girls more complex than i find women in most tv shows I watch and it's not like they don't have happy phases. It's just that nothing's ever perfect and that's what is shown. The dating world can be tough, a romantic relationship can be very hard and staying friends for a long amount of time can be difficult and it doesn't always work out.

About those articles - I will not get into discussing it rn, because it's just a little much. There are some great arguments made there and some things I do not agree with. But I respect the opinion and it's fine. The series - to me - is not flawless by any means. But I myself enjoyed it alot better than most shows I watch.

It was interesting to discuss this with you! 

Well, to be honest, I think the old concept is starting to become old hat now. Realism seems to be the first order of the day. Which I don't really get. Unless it's a detective drama or something based on a true story, any depressing realities are just a downer. Who wants to watch that? If you don't feel confident in how you look and have bad sex all the time, why would you want to watch a show to remind you of it? Fictional shows used supposed to be about escapism and making us feel happy and uplifted, not sad and blue. I think the prevailing idea is that women don't think they're pretty and don't think they're sex goddesses, so seeing both those things depicted on all our tv shows is going to lower their self-esteem. Well, personally, I've always experienced it the opposite way. I always looked at this stuff and thought: "That could be me one day." I was already happy with how I looked and there's ways you can still improve that side, without resorting to major surgery or anything. And if you practice enough, you'll become better at sex, particularly if you're doing it with the right person. Sure, I fear I'll never have that, but I would feel even more depressed if I saw the sad excuse of realistic sexual depictions today. I want something I can strive toward, something to improve, something that can give me a bit of hope. If you just see the negative, you'll have no drive to get better out of life. Women are sent the overwhelming message of "You'll never be as beautiful as celebrities, but that's ok." That's supposed to be a positive message but it's awful! It's right up there with my other hated one: "You can't be pretty and smart." It tells us never to strive for self-improvement, just be content with the sad reality of existence. You'll never be perfect, so why try? It makes the girls out there who are pretty and smart and all other manner of wonderful things doubt themselves because they're told that it's not the done thing to have confidence in yourself. So, shows that aim to content with their sad lives just frustrate me. When men are empowered, they're happy, confident, carefree. But apparently, a empowering show for women involves them being sad, stressed, lacking confidence. And this is supposed to be feminist. It seems like the most un-feminist thing ever.

I think, at the end of the day, I still struggle to this day to find a show that truly represents me as a woman. Every depiction of us out there is either a rich bitch or a sad woman with nothing but unhappiness in her life. Nothing, as the Independent author said that is "nuanced, complex and defying simple categorization." I think it's an interesting comeback to all the unquestioned elements of feminist ideals, that's all.

But I appreciate that you took the time to listen, understand and appreciate what I have to say without trying argue back rudely, like I'm used to getting. That respect means a lot.

[Princess Stache 2,066]

Why do people hate her? Im genuinely curious because I know nothing about the woman.

[Buddy 5,686]

4 hours ago, Princess Stache said:

Why do people hate her? Im genuinely curious because I know nothing about the woman.

because she's a social justice warrior with a victim complex

[Altair 1,999]

Female rebellion? 

[not asher613 661]

15 hours ago, StrawberryBlond said:

Well, to be honest, I think the old concept is starting to become old hat now. Realism seems to be the first order of the day. Which I don't really get. Unless it's a detective drama or something based on a true story, any depressing realities are just a downer. Who wants to watch that? If you don't feel confident in how you look and have bad sex all the time, why would you want to watch a show to remind you of it? Fictional shows used supposed to be about escapism and making us feel happy and uplifted, not sad and blue. I think the prevailing idea is that women don't think they're pretty and don't think they're sex goddesses, so seeing both those things depicted on all our tv shows is going to lower their self-esteem. Well, personally, I've always experienced it the opposite way. I always looked at this stuff and thought: "That could be me one day." I was already happy with how I looked and there's ways you can still improve that side, without resorting to major surgery or anything. And if you practice enough, you'll become better at sex, particularly if you're doing it with the right person. Sure, I fear I'll never have that, but I would feel even more depressed if I saw the sad excuse of realistic sexual depictions today. I want something I can strive toward, something to improve, something that can give me a bit of hope. If you just see the negative, you'll have no drive to get better out of life. Women are sent the overwhelming message of "You'll never be as beautiful as celebrities, but that's ok." That's supposed to be a positive message but it's awful! It's right up there with my other hated one: "You can't be pretty and smart." It tells us never to strive for self-improvement, just be content with the sad reality of existence. You'll never be perfect, so why try? It makes the girls out there who are pretty and smart and all other manner of wonderful things doubt themselves because they're told that it's not the done thing to have confidence in yourself. So, shows that aim to content with their sad lives just frustrate me. When men are empowered, they're happy, confident, carefree. But apparently, a empowering show for women involves them being sad, stressed, lacking confidence. And this is supposed to be feminist. It seems like the most un-feminist thing ever.

I think, at the end of the day, I still struggle to this day to find a show that truly represents me as a woman. Every depiction of us out there is either a rich bitch or a sad woman with nothing but unhappiness in her life. Nothing, as the Independent author said that is "nuanced, complex and defying simple categorization." I think it's an interesting comeback to all the unquestioned elements of feminist ideals, that's all.

But I appreciate that you took the time to listen, understand and appreciate what I have to say without trying argue back rudely, like I'm used to getting. That respect means a lot.

A: people who are already aware of life's struggles in a realistic way. 

good writers can bring a perspective to life which allows us to see our own peculiarities or hidden selves in the context of an holistic character- one that we, and others, can relate to as normal or ok and we can know acceptance through our shared embrace of a flawed personality. it is also a way to spark conversation around topics that are difficult to discuss, so there's a kindness and responsibility to it.

its pretty basic, it's hugely important to how the west continues to use  liberalism as a vehicle for enrichment, and o it's just about everything gaga has tried to be with just about o everything she's ever done so

edit: I'm yaasing myself for this post. there's too much strange here for me to rely on this thread to do it. but it's a yaaser 

 

[brownie 5]

On 9/23/2017 at 10:03 AM, Oriane said:

If anything her parents are guilty for not telling her you can't touch these parts unless the other one agrees to it...

Lena's parents are SUPER artsy, hardcore liberal, "modern artist" parents. Her dad had a whole art show about **** art. 

Lena grew up in this very rich, white, privileged art bubble -- and her writing shows it. She doesn't know "boundaries" like the rest of us do. 

(Not defending or arguing for her...but it has to be pointed out that Lena's parents may have affected her...)

[brownie 5]

On 9/25/2017 at 9:34 AM, NewYorkCity said:

Omg I didn't know about the drama of this girl fingering her little sister but you guys are too much lmao 

like seriously? SHE WAS 7 YEARS OLD. OMG It is NORMAL. You seriously call a 7 YEARS OLD a sexual abuser and child molester? I think you are the ones with problems in your head if you see that in a 7 years old brain. I can't believe it  

 

She also claimed a guy she had bad sex with raped her. And no, I wasn't fingering my little sister at 7.

[brownie 5]

On 9/25/2017 at 5:03 PM, Buddy said:

because she's a social justice warrior with a victim complex

You hit the nail on the head. 

As a 22-year-old just starting in the film industry, Lena was one of my heroes originally -- someone as young as her landing an HBO show she writes, directs, acts, and produces? AMAZING. 

Then I realized she only got the show cause of all her parents' connections and her privilege -- and then all she proceeded to do was complain about the show's critics, make herself a victim despite being very rich and connected, and turn the show into "watch Lena act terrible to people." I loved GIRLS Seasons 1-2, but 3-4 were rough and I stopped watching at 5. Don't even know how the show ends -- her horrible public personality turned her from my hero to someone I blocked on twitter, since I was tired of seeing all her rants about herself.  

[lego 44,165]

On 9/25/2017 at 7:34 PM, NewYorkCity said:

Omg I didn't know about the drama of this girl fingering her little sister but you guys are too much lmao 

like seriously? SHE WAS 7 YEARS OLD. OMG It is NORMAL. You seriously call a 7 YEARS OLD a sexual abuser and child molester? I think you are the ones with problems in your head if you see that in a 7 years old brain. I can't believe it  

 

 

 

I don’t want to get involved in discussion about this person, but sorry what she described in her book is NOT NORMAL.

This is not what 7 year old girls normally do with their baby siblings. 

 

 

[heimerdinger 36]

Who is Lena Dunham and why do people h8 her so much?