My issue with criticisms of "The Cure"

[StrawberryBlond 13,262]

You are so right. The radio just doesn't want to know, regardless of what she does. Because she's not new anymore, she's put at the bottom of the pile. It happens to most artists and it's ridiculous. The only ones radio wants to support is the newest ones, regardless of the quality of their music. Everyone would all over The Cure upon release if it was literally any new, current artist or DJ. But from someone like Gaga, who's had her peak, who's not cool anymore? They pass. Drives me insane.

There's no artist who can reinvent the wheel with every album. That's impossible. If your only aim as an artist is to make new styles of music or to make all styles of music popular, well, that's a bit pretentious. The ultimate aim should be to make great music, even if it's nothing new. Even as a Gaga fan from the beginning, I never expected her to be different with every album, so why should pop fans in general? And Gaga has been different with every album. She never gives you the same album twice and every album is a different sound, a different aesthetic, different looks, different ways of thinking. If this isn't setting an agenda, I don't know what is.

[juju 18,907]

55 minutes ago, vpez said:

Yes, that's why I love Do What U Want so much, (for me) the song is exactly about that. 

Btw, your writing skills are awesome too 

thanks queen  And same, DWUW is my favorite single she's ever released!

51 minutes ago, TeenIdle said:

@juju Where did the 'bae' go? 

I reinvented myself, my Jeauxanne era  

48 minutes ago, anomdepllume said:

Wonderful post. I had to warm up to The Cure because I personally really fell in love with the Joanne sound, but it's a really well done pop song. That's why I love Gaga, she can do whatever the hell she wants and there's always something interesting or enjoyable about it. It might not be my cup of tea (I'm not really into tropical house) but it's Gaga's take on it as opposed to something more basic. I've said this before, but it's definitely the perfect Coachella track. Releasing it how she did was genius, and shows that she can still surprise all of us.

It amazes me how all the little hypocrites so hungry for a radio friendly sound have suddenly turned heel back to wanting the Joanne aesthetic. 

YESYESYES. The fact that this was debuted at Coachella is like... it's beyond genius. She took the opportunity where the spotlight was on her to do something many don't bother to do anymore. And right before the summer? She knows what she's doing  

51 minutes ago, blackcoffee said:

So much truth and great points in this thread. I totally agree with ya @juju and @Bebe. Thank you for taking the time to do eloquently explain your feelings about this...you hit a nail on the head for some of us and I know I am one who feels the same way as y'all. Like it's a weird feeling. Don't hate it, it's nice, but I feel this huge sense of disappointment with it, especially after Joanne. 

Thank you  I adored the Joanne sound, and was both taken off guard by it as I was impressed and enthralled. I personally still find it timeless and it garners repeated plays from me almost every day; I can never say no to new Gaga. She'll continue to surprise us for many years to come.

58 minutes ago, Panchecco said:

I agree on everything you said

Gaga is somehow always judged for whatever she does not only by the public but by her fans as well, and when fans try to put gaga in a box or simply won't let her express herself as she likes it's extremely annoying and actually disrespectful 

we truly don't deserve her and her talent

 

We truly don't  She's too good for us tbh. And thanks for reading all my mess  

52 minutes ago, sipthistea said:

I agree with most of what you wrote, because you described how Gaga's career has evolved and how she has handled it in a way that's always unexpected. Some people may say she's "trying too hard", or that she's just "weird", or even with Joanne she was called "boring" for bringing back a sound that she loves. But that's what she's all about, changing, evolving, and doing what she feels like to do. 

However, all these changes and all these unexpected career moves were genuine, and they represented something. Even when she was too over the top, it was her. There was always an intention behind. When The Cure came out, I felt like she was giving up. The sound and the lyrics are made in a way that it's just too simple and too easy to digest that they feel empty. Like it was just made strictly for the charts. So the reason why I didn't like this is because it goes against the art, the idea, the creation. Even if the lyrics are about healing and loving, neither the vocals nor the production showcase that. And it makes me wonder if she will continue to do music for the charts, because it's not the same and it lacks the Gaga factor that makes her music exciting.

Gaga really said it best when she described that her art could mean anything; I think, on the surface, The Cure can be seen as seemingly shallow/simple/generic. But when compared to what she's done previously - like when comparing Bad Romance, Born This Way, and even Perfect Illusion to what she had previously released during their respective releases - she's continuing to transform. Seeing her track record, she won't stay in one place for too long, so I definitely wouldn't  worry about her only making music for the charts. She's too thirsty for evolving   

57 minutes ago, StrawberryBlond said:

You are so right. The radio just doesn't want to know, regardless of what she does. Because she's not new anymore, she's put at the bottom of the pile. It happens to most artists and it's ridiculous. The only ones radio wants to support is the newest ones, regardless of the quality of their music. Everyone would all over The Cure upon release if it was literally any new, current artist or DJ. But from someone like Gaga, who's had her peak, who's not cool anymore? They pass. Drives me insane.

There's no artist who can reinvent the wheel with every album. That's impossible. If your only aim as an artist is to make new styles of music or to make all styles of music popular, well, that's a bit pretentious. The ultimate aim should be to make great music, even if it's nothing new. Even as a Gaga fan from the beginning, I never expected her to be different with every album, so why should pop fans in general? And Gaga has been different with every album. She never gives you the same album twice and every album is a different sound, a different aesthetic, different looks, different ways of thinking. If this isn't setting an agenda, I don't know what is.

Exactly, had any of the new batch of pop girls released The Cure, it would be a Top 5 hit in an instant. But for an artist like Gaga, there seems to be a double standard. 

Thank y'all for the discourse  I feel like this is my first thread here. Even with the differences of opinion on certain things, it's refreshing to get meta once in a while.

[Werk 13,165]

I agree with you sis. 

I'm cool with Gaga going with a trend however I'm just personally not a fam about this specific sound that's all 

[pdaines 209]

6 hours ago, Killa said:

I agree to some degree, because Joanne as well as Perfect Illusion lacked something. It was not trendy but it wasn't good enough to really make a point. Perfect illusion is an addicting song, i like the fury, the structure is ideal, it should be a killer and it kinda.

And that was the opposite of what was in, that is this easy listening trend, that she just nailed. That should amazing, how she proved she could do something more lowkey after ARTPOP and Perfect illusion, that are everything but casual listening.

I'm proud of her, i think she wrote a nice song, and it may not be groundbreaking but it has that flawless quality to it. A good pop song, you listen and you dont feel like changing anything, and she did that, standard. She proved once again that she nails pop music. In Joanne there was too much compromising, imo.

 

I feel like maybe she could have created a trend with perfect illusion if she had a whole album of songs that did the same thing, with each one better than the last, so that the second single would do better than the first, and the next thing you know everyone loves all the songs. 

You can't create a trend by going hard left field and then pivoting rightward and then pretending like you never went left to begin with. 

 

[juicyjuicy 1,228]

Criticism that she isn't setting the agenda / releases soulless, generic pop music makes me so furious.

CAN'T PLEASE EVERYONE

PEOPLE WHO DON'T UNDERSTAND HER LEGACY / TALENT ARE LESSER. LET'S GO WITH THAT.

[Reality 65,695]

You stated exactly my issues with the criticisms I see for The Cure. You hit the nail on the head, and you were so articulate in saying in so

Now, this is just another criticism I have with the level of hypocrisy that comes through with The Cure. Besides all the fabulous things the OP mentioned, it's also important to note how hypocritical people can be when they're talking about The Cure, and how they talk about Dancin' In Circles.

Now, I love both songs, but I love The Cure more, but that has no effect in what I'm about to say. First, DIC is more of a "trendy, tropical-house pop song" than TC is, in my opinion. The only thing "pop trendy" about The Cure are really the instrumentals at the beginning/end of the choruses, and the snaps, other than that, everything else sounds pretty "GAGA" to me.

But, the main point is that, why are we so critical of TC, when people praised DIC to death? I mean, I'm not the only one that has to remember the 100 threads talking about how they want DIC as the next single from Joanne, right? They both are songs that meet today's pop trend, but it just annoys the hell out of me when people pick and choose. Like, they're both equally "pop trendy", so don't critique TC about being "generic pop trash", when you could easily do it for DIC.

 

[freebit 6,069]

RME @ that PJ quote about Just Dance. The Fame did help bring a dance-y sound to the forefront (long previously abandoned by US radio), but it was also a sound that was being slowly built up over the years with Cascada, Roisin Murphy, Annie, Ladytron, Nelly Furtado & Timbaland, and it all crescendoed into one huge moment and movement in 2008. She didn't make it happen out of thin air. Timing was a MAJOR factor. It was beautiful to watch. 

I also think it's interesting that when you outright ask what music these people want Gaga to do, they often can't even describe it themselves. And if you do get some answers, the answers are wildly different across the board.

Anyway, you hit the nail on the head. At the end of the day, Gaga is still a pop star. She's also an artist. Sometimes she's going to think and make decisions more with the Madonna side of her brain rather than the Bowie/Bjork part of herself. 

[YeehawKylie 7,817]

Her career has been a double-edged sword since The Fame Monster. When you reach that level of success and are such a dominant force in pop culture, there is an incredibly unrealistic expectation that follows. It has seemed like with each subsequent project Lady Gaga is either labeled: a try-hard; an artist who will never, or simply cannot, replicate their early success; or, a sell-out. The Entertainment Weekly review was very spot-on. We expect 'different' from Gaga. Born this Way was much darker; ARTPOP was more experimental and risky; and Joanne followed no radio trends and abandoned some of Lady Gaga's signature sounds. The Cure, on the other hand, is commercially friendly and does sit well among other songs popular at this time. However, she did something critics have been begging her to do for five years: she released a project that was not pretentious. While The Cure may sound similar to other popular music, I think most agree it is a good example or interpretation of popular music...that the lyrics and production sit slightly above its counterparts. Here is Gaga putting out a song for the fun of it. No grand project or theme, no pretentious this or that. The GP and critics always wanted good, easy pop music from Gaga and now they have it. 

[juju 18,907]

7 hours ago, freebit said:

RME @ that PJ quote about Just Dance. The Fame did help bring a dance-y sound to the forefront (long previously abandoned by US radio), but it was also a sound that was being slowly built up over the years with Cascada, Roisin Murphy, Annie, Ladytron, Nelly Furtado & Timbaland, and it all crescendoed into one huge moment and movement in 2008. She didn't make it happen out of thin air. Timing was a MAJOR factor. It was beautiful to watch. 

I also think it's interesting that when you outright ask what music these people want Gaga to do, they often can't even describe it themselves. And if you do get some answers, the answers are wildly different across the board.

Anyway, you hit the nail on the head. At the end of the day, Gaga is still a pop star. She's also an artist. Sometimes she's going to think and make decisions more with the Madonna side of her brain rather than the Bowie/Bjork part of herself. 

So many amazing points!  IA 100%, Gaga didn't invent the wheel with The Fame - she just had incredible success with the blueprints that had been laid out before her; if anything, she took that underground pop/dance music into a progressive enough direction that it was both tantalizing and interesting, but it can't all be accredited to her alone. I find her more responsible for reviving the art of the music video, and for bringing high fashion into the mainstream. 

I like the part about going with her Madonna side as opposed to the Bowie/Bjork side, I couldn't have said it better myself!

7 hours ago, IndieKylie said:

Her career has been a double-edged sword since The Fame Monster. When you reach that level of success and are such a dominant force in pop culture, there is an incredibly unrealistic expectation that follows. It has seemed like with each subsequent project Lady Gaga is either labeled: a try-hard; an artist who will never, or simply cannot, replicate their early success; or, a sell-out. The Entertainment Weekly review was very spot-on. We expect 'different' from Gaga. Born this Way was much darker; ARTPOP was more experimental and risky; and Joanne followed no radio trends and abandoned some of Lady Gaga's signature sounds. The Cure, on the other hand, is commercially friendly and does sit well among other songs popular at this time. However, she did something critics have been begging her to do for five years: she released a project that was not pretentious. While The Cure may sound similar to other popular music, I think most agree it is a good example or interpretation of popular music...that the lyrics and production sit slightly above its counterparts. Here is Gaga putting out a song for the fun of it. No grand project or theme, no pretentious this or that. The GP and critics always wanted good, easy pop music from Gaga and now they have it. 

100% agree with all of this too!   And it definitely highlights on my point of her being held to a higher regard than any of her contemporaries, which I find so unfair to process of creativity and more importantly, her overall happiness.

My all-time favorite critique of Gaga's music, something I think still applies to this day, was by Ed Potton from The Times for ARTPOP: "It's a wonder you can hear Lady Gaga's third studio album over the sound of knives being sharpened".

[Doot 2]

I don't think The Cure was ever meant to be some revolutionary song. It was clearly a random song she dropped to tide fans over until the store while she is shooting a movie.

 

Just Dance is miles better than Perfect Illusion, and while I agree that PI doesn't sound anything like her other stuff, music sounding different doesn't necessarily mean the music is good. 

 

 

 

(I like PI)